Some things I've been thinking about
Off-topic post ahead, that has basically nothing to do with frugality! Also: it's gonna be a little rambly because I am figuring this out as I type.
You've been warned. 😉
You know how on Friday, I mentioned something in passing about my grades, and about how I was wondering if I'm being prideful about them?
I read all of your sweet comments on the topic, and I've been mulling over that whole topic, trying to figure out what is the way that I want to think about this.
I felt happy on Thursday when grades came out, and then on Friday morning when I woke up, I felt really down. Not about the semester ending; I was crying because I had this nagging feeling that I should not be proud of myself.
That I should give the credit to someone else.
That I should downplay my efforts.
That I should be smaller, more muted, more self-effacing.
And the tears were there because a part of me knew that someone else in my shoes might feel unmitigated joy. But that was out of reach for me.
The voices in my head are relentless; they're busy deflating me by telling me variations of, "Don't be proud of yourself."
Someone says, "But you have worked so hard!" and The Voices say, "You should just be grateful that someone else taught you how to work hard." or, "You can be grateful God gave you a good work ethic."
I want to share my joy over my success, and The Voices say, "Don't talk about it, because it might make other people feel bad."
Someone says, "You are so smart!" and The Voices say, "You can be grateful that God gave you a good brain."
The other day, I was telling a friend that you can see this if you read what I wrote about the whole, "I kept us here with words" idea.
In that post, I let myself feel a little bit of defiant pride and then I circled right back around and corrected that to a humbly grateful attitude.
The rule: Only I need to be small
The weird thing is, I would never expect anyone else to think this way about themselves.
I had a friend who needed a pretty high grade on the final in order to pass med surg, and she worked so so so hard prepping for finals. When she texted me to tell me about her grade, I nearly screamed with happiness. And tears came to my eyes.
I immediately told her, "I'm so proud of you! And I think you should be so proud of yourself too. You worked super hard for this."
And as "I passed!" messages rolled in from my friends that afternoon, I cheered all of them on.
When Zoe finished her last final, I told her something very similar to what I told my friends, and then I took her out to dinner to celebrate.
I can give this encouragement to others, but I am struggling to give it to myself.
Some of the roots of these thoughts trace back to particular people and things they've said ("You are just going to nursing school for the attention you will get.", for example), but also to theology that emphasizes my nothingness, my unworthiness, and my total depravity.
Trying to talk myself out of this logically does not work.
It's like I have a big, spiritual block in my brain that says, "Nope, it is never ok to take credit. You are nothing. Everything you do needs to be credited to God/someone else."
Bridge thoughts
Natalie Hoffman* often suggests that our brains do better with a bridge thought than with a big leap.
*Natalie was excommunicated by John Piper's church, Bethlehem Baptist, for leaving her emotionally and spiritually abusive marriage, and now she helps other women who are in the same boat with their marriages.
Trying to make a huge thought correction is just too much for our brains to handle; they resist that.
So, I've been pondering....what is a bridge thought? What's a baby step toward a more balanced and happy view of myself and my accomplishments?
Here are a few I've come up with to try on for size.
One
First, I landed on this: a prideful person would probably want to be better than everyone else, and that is not what I want.
I wanted my whole class to pass. I helped friends study so that they could have a better chance of passing. I felt unmitigated joy at their successes.
And I also feel super happy for my classmates who routinely get grades as high as mine; I think there is room for all of us to do great in nursing school.
Two
Another option: maybe there is room for some less black-and-white thinking here. Maybe I can recognize the privileges I have had and also give myself a pinch of credit for maximizing those advantages.
A related thought: I could also make a little space for acknowledging that I have experienced some difficulties along the way.
My path has not been the hardest one in the world, but it has also not been 100% easy.
Three
Maybe there is a difference between a) being satisfied with an outcome and b) being prideful and self-centered.
Four
Maybe it is completely morally neutral to share a joy/success with someone. Maybe that is not the same as bragging. Maybe that's not the same as just doing something for attention.
I want others to share their joys with me so that I can celebrate with them, so honestly, it should be fine for me to do the same. It's part of what makes relationships rich and wonderful.
We'll see if these ideas can manage to take root in my brain and offer some pushback to The Voices. 🙂
__________________
If you made it this far, ummmmm...thank you for listening!
I hope this was helpful or at least interesting. And I hope that if you have had similar struggles, you feel a bit less alone.
You strike me as someone who needs a purpose, who wants to help others. If you get great grades in your nursing school, you will be the nurse that your patients deserve. In getting those good grades, you are becoming a great nurse, and so many will benefit from that!
These thoughts sound like you're making progress! You work hard, using the gifts you have, and you will make the world better. Maybe if you reframe "pride" as "joyful satisfaction" , you'd feel less conflict about all you've done.
And quite frankly, there are lots of ways to get attention that are a lot easier than nursing school - whoever said that to you has a very weird view of the world.
Enjoy your summer break!
@mbmom11, I agree. That particular attempted insult was so weird that all I could do was laugh at it. FG, I'm sorry it struck home for you.
I mean, really, wouldn't starting a blog to tell the world how YOU do frugality be a more likely example of ego?
Well, yes, that was my thought as well. A lot more people see me blogging than will see me nursing.
Although I suppose if you consider that I blog about going to nursing school....then maybe that was the issue?
@mbmom11,
I felt the same way about that particular comment. Lots of people get a lot of attention for doing wacky things that they then post to YouTube, TikTok, or other social media sites...thinking of some of the YouTubers my son used to watch....so glad he moved on from those particular videos (too much screaming, and too many perfectly good objects destroyed!). Most people go into nursing because they want to help other people (and, my opinion, some because they know they can get a job, and don't really feel called to it - Kristen is NOT in that last category), not to call attention to themselves.
@Liz B.,
as I noted at the time of Kristen sharing that weird comment, what is wrong with wanting attention, actually? Is it immoral? Is it wrong to want to share a bit about what one is doing and how one is doing it when many of those things apply A LOT to A LOT of people of all shapes and creeds?
If we think about it, wanting to be seen and heard sometimes is completely normal and healthy.
@Caro, that's a really good point that it's healthy to want to be seen and heard. It's a basic human need.
You should absolutely be proud of yourself. You have worked so so hard. I love hearing about how you are getting on, and am so pleased when I read you have achieved good grades, just like you are when your fellow students do! It shows that you really care about being the best Nurse you can be!
You never ever sound boastful or self centered.
I am around your age and I think it is great that you are showing everyone that you can follow your dreams! You are going to make a fantastic Nurse. X
I have lots of thoughts on this, many of which I need to mull over for a bit. But the one thing I'm certain of is this: It is one thing to be in a room of strangers at a conference (or some such place) talking about jelly beans (or some other topic) and insert arrogantly into a conversation that you maintained a 4.0, but it is entirely different to be in a roomful of friends (this blog) and share why you are happy. One is bragging and one is not; we all know the difference when we see it. If a person doesn't and is offended, it is likely that person will be offended no matter what is said or not said. We all have met somebody like that.
Now. I think the bridge thought is a good idea because when we try to make big changes, sometimes we go too far in the other direction? Isn't it possible that we can be grateful to God, our parents, etc. who have supported us AND to have good feelings about ourselves for the part we played? I don't see it as an either/or situation. I see it as a both/and situation.
@Jody S., I agree. Being proud of your accomplishments and being grateful for the help/blessings that helped get you there are not mutually exclusive. You are the one who did all the work. Congratulations! So proud of you.
I don’t think I have ever commented but I am a long time reader. 🙂
You've got some free time now, so I urge you to go read "Song of Myself" by Walt Whitman and then sound your barbaric yawp over the roofs of the world. By the way, he was also a nurse.
@Becca, I've quoted dear old Walt's "barbaric yawp" line more often than I can recall. Glad there's another "Song of Myself" fan out there.
@A. Marie, yes! All the barbaric yawps.
@Becca,
I think Barbaric Yawp would make a great punk rock band name. 🙂
Another explanation: Just after passing you are still high on endorphins and stress hormones (and what not - you are the medical expert so you know that better). And this feeling disappears soon, you will feel down and self-critical. I think that happens to me quite often. 🙂
@Lina, I was thinking the same thing. Second guessing yourself and debriefing all in one - a stress response to a very full few months of hard work. When its finally over and you realize you are reaching your goals, you can't help but have a little self-doubt creep in. I think the feelings are normal, but hope Kristen pushes forward anyway, because the fact is - we need more really good nurses. We do.
I will, I will. I am not giving up!
Your work ethic, intelligence and kindness are all gifts from God. It is not prideful to rejoice in the good fruit of those gifts.
I don't think of you as prideful AT all! I am someone who has never struggled with school. God blessed me with a good brain. However, I would not have gotten through college/professional school without a lot of hard work! So I can be grateful to God for the blessing of a good brain and also acknowledge the work I have done myself to make the most out of my gifts.
You were blessed with brains but you still had to put in a LOT of work yourself!
Something about your post here also reminds me of the Bible story of the "Parable of the talents". We are called to not only thank God for our material or abstract gifts, but also to use them wisely. I think you do just that.
@SK, Exactly!!
@SK, yes, I came here to say pretty much this same thing. There are lots of people who are blessed with talents and gifts who squander them OR who use them selfishly/meanly. Our choices and our hard work do matter. Free will is important in my faith and my life.
Kristen, I have been through exactly this cycle so many times and for similar reasons. Finding those bridge thoughts can be challenging! I try to remember that there are people whose conversations and thoughts are largely about themselves and their accomplishments and who rarely acknowledge those who helped put them on their path to success. Those people ARE boastful and arrogant. They don't listen to others, care for others, or celebrate other people's joys. They see life as a competition. But success (at least most kinds worth having) isn't a pie - good grades for you don't mean less for others. We have to believe that we are worthy of being celebrated, worthy of having our hard work pay off. And yes, in that we can and should honor those who helped us get there, just as those we help will do the same when they celebrate their successes.
I hope you (and all of us) can keep those voices in their proper place and that struggle to do so gets easier with every step that deserves to be celebrated!
@SK, bravo and amen!
@Heather,
well said
It makes me sad to think that your very justified pride in yourself is not a completely joyful experience for you. I'm glad you're recognizing and trying to re-work these thoughts, though, because you absolutely deserve to be happy in your accomplishments.
@kristin @ going country, thanks for saying what I'm thinking, more concisely than I would have said it. I second your motion.
@kristin @ going country,
I'll just echo these thoughts. I appreciated you sharing your take, Kristen. It's not something I think about, so it was very enlightening to hear what's going on in the background for you.
I was raised to consider both (my family was not religious) - appreciate your gifts AND your hard work, both of which are required for most of your accomplishments. Some gifts are more about hard work (I'm not at all athletic, yet pursue many athletic endeavors solely through grit & effort), vs on the academic side, I was definitely blessed with more than the athletic side. College & grad school required plenty of effort, AND I'm grateful that I was blessed with the mental aptitude to tackle it.
I also feel sad that anyone tied your desire to become a nurse with anything to do with getting attention (“You are just going to nursing school for the attention you will get"). Nursing absolutely doesn't strike me as the type of profession you go into for attention. Now, if you wanted to be a super model or a pop star, nothing wrong with either of those if you so desire, but those are more roles that are at the center of attention.
Haha, well, no one needs to worry that I will try to pursue either of those jobs. lol
Kristen, I can't imagine anyone saying that you're prideful (but based on the comment you mentioned about getting attention, maybe, sadly, there is). Just the fact that you have concerns about being prideful demonstrates that you are, in fact, not prideful.
Perhaps another bridge thought is that you are being a good steward of the gifts God has given you (intelligence, strength, understanding, and the desire to do good in the world)?
I can't help but think of my husband, who went back to school in his 40s to get his degree. He graduated with a 4.0, never missing an A in community college, university, and graduate school. He was proud of his accomplishments, but never prideful (I hope that makes sense). It strikes me that there may be a gender difference here. Which is so sad. My husband always knew that his gifts came from God. But also that he worked hard for those grades. It can be both, I think.
Somewhat related, this conversation also makes me think of when I was accused of being greedy. I had to work through that with a counselor and through prayer for months, maybe years, before I came to see that it wasn't me who was greedy. Words are so powerful, and they can be devastating when used to push down instead of to build up. ("You just want attention." "You're greedy and don't want to share.") I'm so sorry that you're having to work through this and that it's so hard to recognize and celebrate accomplishments that you had a part in. I hope that someday it will be as easy for you, as it is for us, this community, to celebrate your successes.
Tell The Voices to sit back down, way in the back, and just hush up!
You are WORTHY of PRAISE
You are WORTHY of some Pride
You are WORTHY of all the POSITIVE things that you are on the receiving end that you are working so hard for.
YOU worked really hard to get your physical and emotional self into a safer place.
YOU work really hard to balance the kids, the marriage dissolving, the independence, the finances, the relationships etc.
YOU worked REALLY HARD to earn the scholarships that paid for the semester so you did not have to work as hard to pay for those classes in $$$.
IN TURN
YOU worked REALLY hard on those classes to learn the material and master it for you and peers, to achieve the grades that the scholarship donators would have wanted you to earn.
YOU have every right to be proud, to share your success and relief.
ALSO- you started this blog to share your tips, stories and gain information in frugality and young family life raising. Your life has changed and your followers very well have also. You have no idea who all is following you. But I would GUARANTEE there is a newly independent (or more than 1) follower trying to figure out HOW to make it work? How to do it all and seeing, reading and 2nd hand experiencing your successes is giving them hope, ideas and the OK to do things a little differently.
Society says buy it new, fresh clean look-so fancy! But you assure them 2nd hand, free hand down is absolutely ok! Sandwiches every night for the week is not a failure- it is food and nourishment. There is NOTHING wrong with enjoying the hustle of the freebies, the discounts, the clearance rack, the birthday months treats! Finding joy in these moments is perfect!
CONGRATULATIONS on your achievements and successes!
“It’s part of what makes relationships rich and wonderful”—yes! You worked hard and every person who saw or read about your work can see that! True friends celebrate the events of each other’s lives, whether those events are murky and complex or ecstatic and delightful. Your blog readers aren’t necessarily “friends” but we’re on the journey with you and please rest assured that we want to know how your story goes! I think it’s natural to avoid boasting about one’s achievements with some audiences, just as one might avoid sharing the intimate details of a tough situation—failing a test or class or dropping out of a program. You’re the one who gets to tell your story AND celebrate yourself!
I am glad that you are making progress on allowing yourself to feel proud - you should be! I do not think God would want you to feel badly about yourself - and there is definitely a wide space in between being prideful and being proud of your hard work and accomplishments. Please enjoy the feeling of your hard work and the gifts he has given you paying off!! 🙂
How do you want your lovely daughters to think about their accomplishments? Just thinking back to how happy and, yes, proud you were of Lisey for following her dreams.
Oh, for sure. I would never want Lisey to be like, "Well, I only succeeded at this because my mom taught me how to work hard and she showed me not to be afraid of manual labor."
I'm sure I had something to do with shaping Lisey, but that is most certainly not the entirety of why she has managed to do all of this, and I would not want her to try to shove off all the credit on me! I want her to be so proud of how she has overcome the challenges she's faced, and how she's done so many brave things.
@Kristen,
As they mature, our children are responsible for their choices and behavior in life (and its consequences). That said, we know from experience how good and "bad" role models play a role in the lives of children.
Modeling kindness, compassion, responsibility, etc as you have for your children IS a part of how they think and learn. Ultimately, it's on them and again, it is not prideful or wrong to acknowledge that you have modeled behavior that has helped form who Lisey is.
By saying you feel you've had some positive influence (of course you have!), it is not taking credit for Lisey being Lisey. Again, those voices in your head.
We are proud of our children not because they are our "mini" mes (although sadly some parents view it that way and also see their children as the extension of them living out the lives they didn't. OMG) but because they mature and become THEMSELVES. And we love and support them even if they end up being very different from us. Because they were given to us to be our clones but rather for us to cherish and love and help them learn how to live in the world they were born into.
Watching how some families and parents have judged and abandoned their children because they do not live as they would wish them, or do not embrace the same beliefs as they do...it is painful. Love is not about people fulfilling our dreams and fantasies. It is about loving who they are.
Maybe, sometimes, from a distance (Iylana Van Zant had a great line in one of her early books referring to her very dysfunctional and harmful family.
I paraphrase. "Sometimes you have to cross the street and love from a great distance."
Sometimes you continue to love but can no longer accept another's judgment on you and how you live. It seems to be a theme in your life that you perhaps unconsciously give more power to those who have criticized you (Seriously, who says that going to nursing school is about getting attention? With all the work and challenges. OMG) ONLY YOU GETS TO SAY WHO YOU ARE.
Love yourself as you love others. Women often have a very hard time doing that, eh?
@Kristen, Right back at you. I'm sure that's how Lisey feels about you: She wants you to be so proud of how you've overcome the challenges you've faced, and how you've done so many brave things. So why shouldn't you feel the same about you? ;-}
@Irena, All if this spoke to me. Your comment is excellent. Thank you.
I love your bridging steps.
Don't forget that you want to do well so that you can become a nurse and help others. Trust that the process (classes, labs, tests, etc.) exists so that you can best offer that assistance.
I have several friends that belong to a wonderful ECLA church and one of their slogans is "Gods work, our hands". They are very involved in helping others within and outside their church.
@K D, I'm a member for many years of an ELCA church and was thinking, as I came from a more fundamental background to this church, that I wished Kristen could experience the freedom I've found that says it's OK to rejoice in using the gifts God has given us to use. Not only that it's OK, but that it's right. God's Work, Our Hands is real. Also, women are not second class citizens. I think a lot of us were taught as women that we were supposed to be not just humble, but meek - kind of like a step behind the others who were in front. I still struggle with this. Imposter syndrome is real. But it is OK to use the gifts we are given and to succeed and be recognized for that success.
Kristen, I love the bridging idea. I would see the bridge as "I'm using the gifts that I've been given and answering the call to Nursing that I've been given. Doing less than my best doesn't serve any purpose. My best just happens to be a 4.0 gpa (not everyone's best is). I can celebrate pulling all the pieces together and my hard work - it's not taking away from anyone else."
Lots to think about. Everything I have comes from words. I used to feel more proud and happy about that--I used to be very proud I could take care of my hurting young adults and my sick mom all by myself--but I don't any more. Not sure why. Illness? I've certainly been far more ill after being hospitalized for COVID 3.5 years ago--bereavement? Needing a break which I don't get? Needing the kind of friendship I had with BFF, which no longer exists? Not having a job and living off savings for most of the past year?
@Rose, You could feel proud of having that savings to finance your life, right?
@Rose, I too have lost my BFF, although to opioid addiction rather than death. Something I've been learning is that many different friends are filling that void, each in her own way.
You are an incredible survivor, very capable and resourceful even in the midst of physical weakness and emotional pain; you are still finding and sharing joy through your struggles. Thank you for letting us get to know you here.
@Jody S., I feel stupid for doing it but it seemed like a good idea at the time. I'm also dismayed that for the first time, employers aren't rushing to hire me. My previous employer said I was something of a legend. Now I'm just old and tired, I guess. Age discrimination is real.
@Rose,
Sadly, age discrimination is alive and well. I've seen it happen with seberal friends and my DH. Of course, employers can never, ever admit to that.
I'm wondering if your status as a legend in your field has employers scared off? Meaning, afraid you would ask for $XXX,XXX when they can only afford $yy, yyy? I know my profession doesn't typically "reward" years of experience. A change was recently made, such that a Masters degree is needed for entry-level jobs (I was grandfathered in, thankfully) - unfortunately, entry level pay ranges have not been adjusted - at least, not in my area. We had one candidate scoff at the entry level pay offered ($25/hour, no benefits), and quite frankly, I don't blame her.
@Liz B.,
several, not seberal
I know that you have a deep faith, but this is one of the reasons why I'm not a fan of religion (generally, not at all to do with specific denominations). Very few of them are feminist, or if they are, it's because they were forced to be. Many of them (Hi Butker!) are... reactionary. The notion that being genuinely proud of yourself is somehow... unwarranted to my mind is another thing that seems quite often to occur among the very religious, even more so to the women. Notions of being self-sacrificial and giving and supportive are fantastic, of course, but very quickly tip into something different.
I hope you allow yourself to feel pride, however many different steps it takes to get there. You have never even hinted that you think you're incredibly wonderful and owe no thanks to any kind of privilege. You've never presented yourself as perfect nor curated. You have got yourself out of a very, very unhappy situation and into a great career, while still doing so much else. It's realistic to be proud of yourself!
@Caro,
Well said! I have some similar thoughts on the matter, but as an atheist, I often hesitate to speak up since so many in this group are deeply religious, and I feel like my thoughts may be unwelcome.
There is so much misogyny in organized religion. It's mind-blowing for me on the outside looking in. I'm sure it's a lot harder to keep the second-class citizens in line if they're actually pleased and proud of themselves!
I also agree that there is a world of difference between being a boastful braggart and being rightfully proud and pleased with the fruits of your efforts, and wanting to share that good news with those around you.
@Caro, As a deeply religious woman who belongs to a conservative denomination, I find your post interesting. I once belonged to a very liberal denomination, so I can understand both viewpoints. I think that more in-depth discussions are necessary for us to understand people with different viewpoints, especially because words like "feminist" means different things to different people. I moved from a church body with female pastors to one with no female pastors, and I am very happy about that. I have never (since my switch) felt like a second-class citizen. I have, in fact, felt more important. But to delve into the reasons for that (if somebody cared to go beyond the surface), in-depth conversations would need to take place. So much animosity in our world, I think, stems from superficial understandings of others. I think labeling somebody as reactionary without taking the time to understand adds to the animosity.
@Jody S., I truly don't understand choosing to be part of a system which says one gender can lead but not the other (and one which subscribes to such a binary system about gender in general, but that's another discussion). I'm not trying to sound rude, I am asking out of good faith (no pun intended).
@Caro & @Karen L, I so appreciate your willingness to wade in on this with your perspectives.
I read somewhere that in patriarchy (regardless of religion), boys are taught and evaluated on WHAT they do (active) and girls on HOW they do (passive). For instance, many people are OK with an otherwise unpalatable leader if he is a man who they perceive as able to get things done. In contrast, women in leadership must think carefully about their tone and presentation while ALSO leading.
I wonder if part of the issue women have with personal success is navigating these expectations. We can't merely succeed, we have to also present the correct posture toward that success in order to be liked/accepted.
@Jody S., My version of feminism is that women should be free to choose what they want to do, where, and how - and also to have the knowledge and perspective to do so fully informed. You’ve freely chosen your religious institution from a position of knowledge and information. You go, girl!
That's mine too; choice feminism!
@Karen L, I share similar beliefs with you and am grateful you shared them.
@Sophie in Denmark, thank you for sharing. The binary systems of thought are very difficult for me in all arenas of life. Either/or rather than both/and is contrary to my thinking.
@Valerie,
I think there is definitely some truth to that. I've noticed how women in political roles are criticized for being too "soft" on the one hand, or not being "warm" enough on the other hand, so somewhat of a no win situation.
@Karen L, I'm on your team. And what you said and Caro are good points and I agree and glad they were voiced.
@Karen L, I'm coming from the same place. You are the genetic sequences you are born with, and what you do (or don't do) with those gifts is totally up to you.
@WilliamB, My feminism does not include choosing subjugation. Frankly I'm a little tired of the idea that feminism means that any choice a woman makes is just fine. That makes the word meaningless.
Much as I disagree with some other people's choices, I do still want them to have those choices. Do I hope that the systems which include subjugation are eventually removed or reformed, though? Yes.
I think if we are putting pressure on women to conform to a certain idea of what WE have determined she should do, then we are still subjugating women in a way. Same problem, different font. I don't think feminism should tell women what to do.
But that is why there are different sects of feminism; like anything, it's not a monolith.
@Karen L, It’s called the double bind, and Kathleen Hall Jamieson wrote a great book about it about 25 years ago.
https://www.publishersweekly.com/9780195089400
@WilliamB, I think I could (mostly) agree to your type of feminism. I think I would stop short of saying free to do anything because some things people want to do endanger others. (Drinking and driving is not a freedom we should have.)
@Sophie in Denmark, This is a challenging question which I've been thinking about most of the day, and I'm fairly certain I can't express all of my thoughts in a blog comment. But I can tell you what led me to my choice. My faith has changed much over my lifetime: my childhood faith, then the atheist phase, then the confused phase, then feeling certain that God existed, then worshipping in the church body of my youth, then feeling dissatisfied with that because of issues (including women as pastors) that I couldn't reconcile with the Bible, having more and more questions, noticing how people around me (in all places) behaved, forming my own opinions about those questions and feeling uncomfortable in the church body I was in because of that, and finally I met my husband whose beliefs happened to (mostly) coincide with my own.
I believe that different people have different vocations and that the vocation of pastor ought not to be held by women. I do think women should have equal rights politically, etc. The Church isn't the World; it's set apart. Church is a choice. If somebody doesn't believe in what a church teaches, they don't have to go. If I change my beliefs, I am free to choose where, if anywhere, I can go.
Within my church body there are those who argue for women's ordination. I want to say to them, "There's a church for you; go out and find it." I faced many negative comments and opinions from my family and friends when I switched. The doctrine of my church is right to me, and I don't want it changed.
My opinions are based on my own life observations. And note, I am NOT part of a church body that forces women to do anything. I wouldn't consider not serving as a pastor subjugation or anything negative. I know many women in my church who are highly educated and have impressive careers.
I think it is likely that my explanation will still sound foreign to many people because it might be very different from what they have experienced, but maybe it's one of those bridges to understanding another? I hope so.
@Jody S., You’re right, I didn’t mean it to be literally anything.
@Jody S., thank you for replying and putting such consideration into it. I appreciate it. I just don't understand why anyone thinks women shouldn't be leaders in a church. And how do transgender and nonbinary people fit into this narrative? A whole other conversation could be had about that!
@WilliamB, my main issue with this is that no one makes choices in a vacuum. We are all affected by society around us, as much as we try not to be. Women wouldn't choose to get botox and try and get a 'bikini body' if society didn't pressure them to look younger and live up to a western beauty ideal. Of course I want people to have those choices, but it doesn't mean we can't be critical of the reasoning behind them.
I have often had this thought when it comes to things like breast augmentation. If we lived in a magical world free of societal beauty pressures, few women would be anxious to pay lots of money to have a foreign object put into their breast area. So, even people who say, "I'm just doing it for me." might not ENTIRELY be doing it for themselves.
@Sophie in Denmark, I think you hit on the big reason you don't understand in your remark to WilliamB when you encouraged being critical of the reasoning. Faith isn't reasoning. It's entirely different. Feelings are one thing. Reasoning is another. Faith is different than both. I can't understand people's feelings sometime because I would feel entirely different. I can't understand people's reasoning sometime because I reason differently. These things can be explained by my different life experiences, genetics, etc. I think it must be the same with faith. I can only say that I believe the Bible to be truth, and that forms my opinions. It is the lens through which I see the world.
@Sophie in Denmark,
I appreciate your good faith question. Here is my good faith answer.
The only reason to believe a thing is because it is true. I do not mean “true for me.” I mean objectively and absolutely true. I realize that many people do not accept the idea of absolute truth. This doesn’t prevent absolute truth from existing any more than not believing that the earth is round makes it flat.
So I believe in Christianity because it is objectively and absolutely true. I didn’t just decide to believe it, there is actually a lot of good evidence to support this belief (as you would and should expect with something that is objectively and absolutely true.)
Because it is true, I want to deeply understand it, just like I want a solid grasp of how gravity works before I go work on my roof. And just like gravity, there’s not an alternative system that you can embrace instead even if it would be more socially acceptable or politically expedient. Jesus is the only way to salvation.
So I’m not looking to shoehorn the Bible into my pre-existing understanding of how things ought to work. I’m reading the Bible to understand how things do work. I’m not looking to my faith community for affirmation of what I am already doing, I’m looking to it to challenge me in areas where I need to be challenged. That’s not to say that churches don’t get things wrong or conform to the culture of now or 200 years ago in a way that is more culturally than Biblically bound. This is why we keep reading the same Book, so that we can understand what it is actually saying.
Anyhow, that’s why I am part of this system. I didn’t look over all systems of belief and choose the most comfortable one, I stumbled into the truth after a long season as a completely happy faithless person and couldn’t choose anything else.
@Tarynkay,
I define "objective" completely contrary than you do. So therein lies the difference. I do accept diversity of thought, inclusion of others and equity within a society. And therefore appreciate each person's story. Thanks for yours.
@Tarynkay, to echo Connie, I also have a completely different definition of objective truth. I think there are various claims in the Bible which have objective evidence to challenge them, as well as the fact that the Bible has so many different translations and books removed from it during that process. I grew up with parents from different churches, so have always had this question in my mind.
I also think men and women have more similarities than differences - we're all people, after all - and our differences are mostly created by culture, rather than being innate. But as @jody s said, this is probably a conversation for outside a blog comment.
Thank you both for the discourse!
@Jody S.,
As I said before, any religion - any religion at all, or any life view of any sort - where it's very clear in lots of ways that women are there to be ''modest'' and ''serve'' and essentially do the drudgery, where men are ''ordained'' as the leaders just on account of the testicles being present at birth are a problem for me and for many others. It can lead to a life of subservience and coercion, of unfulfilled potential, of people denying themselves happy, fulfilled lives. No conversation or deep attempts to understand are required. The obvious results speak for themselves very clearly. Headship and all of that pernicious stuff leads to women being brainwashed in so many ways and there is no way to thread the needle that makes it okay.
Just because you believe something doesn't mean it's true! 😉
We all have those nasty voices, partially planted in our psyche during times we were vulnerable. They are hard to get rid of, but it is possible, so use a bridge or whatever works for you.
Really great post, Kristen!! I agree with the early comments this morning - love all the support and encouragement for you!! That double-standard paradox you mentioned is clarifying, right? It's not healthy to think that all good things are a result of others, while any negative things are from within. Humans are capable of extreme good and extreme bad- and even a mix (because we're human!). Clearly you have built amazing good out of difficult circumstances - that is awesome & worth celebrating. We're glad to celebrate with you!!
On a related note, being real through the highs and lows also gives hope and encouragement to others (you have done this so graciously, while respecting other people's privacy). I recently shared your blog/story with a friend who is going through a separation and returning to classes later in life. I can't even begin to imagine how many lives you've touched with your blog <3
It's really hard to work through the beliefs we internalized as children and teenagers. I commend you for doing so, in such a busy time of your life, and sharing it publically so others can benefit!
The comment that you would want to go to nursing school for the attention is puzzling. Nursing doesn’t strike me as a profession where people are just showered with accolades. More like a profession where you are showered with… other things, things that necessitate showering afterwards. In fact, nursing seems like a profession with so many humbling opportunities
It makes sense you are concerned with being prideful as pride is both very dangerous and the most celebrated of sins. Pride leads to contempt for others and contempt for others leads to every other sin. But you do not sound prideful, if that helps. You sound more like Eric Liddel, the Olympic runner who said, “God made me fast and I feel his pleasure when I run.”
I was puzzled by that accusation too, especially because I am already a blogger with a decent-sized following. If I wanted attention, I'd just focus on growing my blog! Nursing is a pretty thankless, non-public profession.
@Kristen, whoever said that stupid thing to you needed a lock on his mouth, and you could have benefitted from earplugs in that situation!
@Kristen, Yes, it’s very puzzling. Which is how you know it was said only to hold you down. It’s so obviously not true.
How to get rid of early childhood/young marriage insults is the hard question. It might help you to explore any resources since soo many readers here telling you they are not true hasn’t helped move the needle.
I have loved following you on your journey to a career you love. Many, myself included, would also love to join you on a journey to quiet the Voices once and for all.
In general, I think that society teaches women that they should be modest and unassuming instead of proud and assertive. However, shouldn’t we be proud of our accomplishments? Is it somehow better to feel that you are not valuable? Your accomplishments are a result of your hardwork and dedication. As you start this new chapter in your life, please do be proud of yourself and all that you have accomplished. Perhaps there were years of your life where you felt the need to make yourself small? I think now is a great moment to realize that you can take up space in a room and that both you and the world will be better for it. Congratulations on your academic success.
This post brought tears to my eyes - such familiar conditioning in my life. I love love love the bridge thought idea.
I'm no longer a Christian, but offer the following musings:
- Coercive humility is a tool for control, and you are a wild, free, expansive being! Who does it benefit when we make ourselves small?
- You are fearfully and wonderfully made - the complex aliveness of you is a delight in the universe, a beautiful, essential part of the larger symphony. When you connect to that joy, you are living truthfully. (and perhaps the same can be said to connecting to the grief of the world.)
- The one who created you knows you more intimately than any human parent knows their child - and what human parent doesn't swell with shared happiness when their kids find their passion and achieve success in their chosen arenas?
-Being a force for good means bringing your whole self to the table - you can't find authenticity or intimacy any other way. We have to live both the joys and hardships fully in order to connect with others. That's how we become 3D in an often 2D world/theology. The proof of it is in the community of real-ness you've built here, and I'm guessing it will help you to connect with patients in an amazing way.
Hugs, Kristen! The deprogramming road can be rough, but so worth it! And I love seeing the fruit of it in your life 🙂
PS - I've been thinking more about perceiving ourselves (strengths and weaknesses) accurately, which is a life skill that is a lot easier when we are not policing our emotions!
My family is chock-full of RNs, including both of my parents. Things I love about nurses broadly are their no-nonsense approach to life, unconditional willingness to hear people out at least once, and their ability to get down to the heart of things quickly. I guess when you are in the trenches healthcare, dealing with life and death brings some matter-of-fact clarity about what's important -- including a balanced view of what you bring to the table.
I'm so glad that exceptionally smart and emotionally intelligent people like you are going into nursing. As a society, we need you!
You have never struck me as 'prideful'. You should though be quite proud of where you are in your life as it took courage and strength to leave a marriage and start a nursing program. You have done exceptionally well and you are not' boastful or egotistical' about it and maybe that's the difference.
Unfortunately there is a huge gender component to this—women’s accomplishments are downplayed and women’s justified pride in those accomplishments is put down as unwarranted, while men are not subjected to the same treatment. Women learn to be self-effacing. It’s part of the reason that women don’t apply for roles that similarly qualified (or less qualified) men don’t hesitate to apply for and that they don’t negotiate higher pay or other perks. Please give yourself the same grace you would give your daughters and resist letting anyone (including you!) minimize your accomplishments.
Maybe a better word than “pride”, which can have a negative connotation, would be “satisfaction”—in a job well done, in using the gifts and advantages and opportunities given.
I think it’s important to GIVE YOURSELF GEACE when you struggle. Life long programming is hard to change.
I too am working on some things in the mentals. I was raised by an abusive mother. I thankfully broke that chain for my nuclear family but I struggle feeling real joy. Ever. I am always in survival mode when there has been nothing to “ survive” for about ten years.
None of us EVER feel like you are bragging. I also feel total JOY for you but cannot feel total joy for myself. I am slowly moving forward.
Kristen. I am not sure how you will receive this but from my heart I want to say a few things to you on this subject. I hope that you know that this is coming from a genuine place of love for you as a friend.
First, God loves you deeply. You are not nothing. Your are worth a great deal and he sees all of you and loves you. He is proud of you as you should be proud of yourself for nurturing and pursuing your purpose on this earth...nursing, being a mother, being a good friend and a kind and wonderful person. I don't personally believe that this is a sinful pride. You are not strutting about with your chest out boasting in your accomplishments but instead quietly acknowledging that you have worked hard to earn something of great value.
I am praying for you always and hope that you continue to share with us on your journey.
Warning … religious overtones
I am so sorry that you are having to wrestle with these feelings. I believe there is room in every heart for both pride (joy) in a job well-done and gratitude for the gifts that we have been given. You honor both yourself and God by using your talents and abilities to better your life and the lives of the people around you. Central to the teachings of Christianity are the ideas of love and acceptance. I do not believe that God meant for us to extend this to everyone except ourselves. Celebrate and give thanks!
I can soooo relate to this! I struggle with these same feelings. I'm a writer and have published many books, which is a big accomplishment, but these kind of thoughts interfere with my enjoyment of that accomplishment. And I do think, for me, a lot of it comes from the teachings I was raised with as a Christian. I'm still a faithful Christian, but I've had to re-examine a lot of things I was taught. In my background, men were lauded for their accomplishments, but women were expected to be self-effacing and supportive of the men. I think that's a kind of toxic Christianity that does more harm than good. So I've come to believe God wants us all to be happy, that we were made to do good things and it's okay to be happy about our accomplishments -- while not putting ourselves above everyone else. We can accept joy for the things we do as well as the things we are given.
The fact that you recognize these thoughts and are addressing them is huge. Be proud of yourself for your accomplishments and for recognizing and addressing what is holding you back. There is a big difference in being proud and being prideful.
In my small group, we always start with "joys and concerns." We celebrate joys and we listen and hold concerns. We pray and support each other through the good and the bad. Often concerns lead to joys. Kristen, you recognize your gratitude each day. Maybe recognizing joys regularly might help reframe your thoughts.
Also, you are not alone in these thoughts. I think a lot of the is patriarchy in practice. It's not always big things. It's the small, subtle, everyday occurrences that are designed to keep us down, submissive so the "power" can be held by the males
I'm not religious anymore but maybe it helps to think of the parable of the seeds. Just because you've been taught to work hard or blessed with a beautiful brain doesn't equate to success. There is certainly plenty of evidence of people who received those gifts and done nothing. Feel proud that you have honored those gifts by putting them to good use. And until that works, just keep sitting with how proud others are of you - eventually it will feel right. I find you so inspiring and I whole heartedly believe you have many reasons to be proud of what you have accomplished.
God gives us each our individual unique gifts. I feel, as long as we recognize they are from Him and give thanks to Him for that, it's ok to be happy with our successes. We can be proud of ourselves for what we put in to obtain that accomplishment. Just because our gift is *insert gift*, we can't just sit on our duff and expect it to come to us. I feel like He's given it to us and in return we are to work on it, and use it to be the best we can be. As long as that happiness is filled with gratitude and humbleness, the Lord rejoices with us in our success.
Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change. James 1:17
For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them Ephesians 2:10
Kristen, your heart is in the right place. You have shown us readers time after time your humbleness and gratefulness in every thing you do. Be proud of yourself. You have overcome so much and are well on your way to being a fantastic nurse, along with already being a loving and supportive mother and hopefully one day, to another mate.
Self awareness, seeing it in front of you, is the beginning of growth and healing - HUZZAH!
Perhaps bridges can be built of many things together. I really like the idea you're exploring about acknowledging your privileges but also your hard work. And realizing that you can be both supportive and empathetic while at the same time being proud of yourself for how hard you worked and how well you've met the [many] challenges you've faced! It's about YOUR journey not beating anyone else right? So there's nothing prideful about that - it's more just satisfaction at seeing your work turn out right. It's not prideful to look at a garden you've planted and weeded and watered and see the beautiful flowers right? Seems the same to me
I confess to having had some of those same thoughts. In my case, it stemmed from being in an emotionally and verbally abusive marriage.
I've "known" you online since before you started your blog. You have never seemed to be anything but open, honest, and humble.
God gives us gifts, but it is up to us to put the work in to utilize them. You are putting in the work, and there is nothing wrong with being proud of your accomplishments.
Your blog always gives me such a lift every day. Thank you!
High grades are fine but the real deal here is what kind of nursing career are you preparing for? As a patient who has experienced 2 major surgeries in my life the nurses who cared for me and were helpful and compassionate were so appreciated. I have special memories of some who were there for me when I was suffering and cared for me. And I was not always such a model patient!
Keep the kitty cat pictures coming. Thanks for them too.
Hi Kristen- I am a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist here in California and I have had many clients who struggled with this same issue. I would recommend that when that “voice” is talking to you , that you stop and acknowledge it as a negative thought and examine it for validity. You have done some of this in this post already. Then quickly reframe it into a more balanced and realistic thought . An example of this might be “ I feel so good about my hard work- I am happy that I scored so well on my tests” This may take some practice but if done consistently negative thoughts will diminish. I also think that sometimes women who have spent many years caring for others have difficulty enjoying accomplishments of their own - finishing your education should be considered a form of self- care as it will benefit yourself and your children going forward. Definitely something to be proud of !
All good and interesting thoughts. I'd like to add another: while God gave you that brain, you're the one who decided to use it well. I'm sure you know people who waste the advantages they have, eh?
I'm also going to repeat something I've said before: you are in a field where knowing the right answers could be a matter of life and death. Getting it wrong could kill someone. Further, you're using your attitudes and skills to help others do the same. They wouldn't look to you for help as readily if they didn't know that you know the material so well.
This conversation feels a little like the ones I've had about anonymous donations vs touted ones. Anon donations are "modest" but do little to be feel-good stories and nothing to encourage others. It's good to know it can be done, eh?
@WilliamB, I always give anonymously. Not to be modest but because giving to me is a private act. It's nobody else's business what I choose to give nor to whom.
I also think women are extremely guilty of feeling this way. We are frequently too humble at work. I have had to coach my female colleagues in the office to stop saying sorry for everything! You don't hear men overuse that word.
I just want to give you a big hug. Our brains are not always kind to us, which is strange because they should be looking out for us. I think it's wonderful that you are taking the time to think through why you are having negative/sad/unfair thoughts and not just believing that you aren't good enough or deserving. Thank you for sharing, hopefully this will help someone else will stop and really think about why they also may not feel good enough or deserving enough.
I have to say, speaking for my church, women are expected to use their gifts in the church and secular life, and are admired for doing so. And I don't mean they just teach vacation Bible school and Sunday School, or work the nursery and get patted on the head for that.
(Although VBS, nursery and SS are important jobs, but they aren't the only jobs women can do.)
Anyway, remember the phrase is "Well DONE, good and faithful servant." Which means one DOES something with the talents one is given. If you waste your talent, that's like rejecting the gift. If you use your gifts, you are doing what you are expected to do. If you use them to the very best of your abilities (like getting A's!), then you are doing great with them. It's made clear that you are pleasing God when you do so. You are allowed to be pleased, too. Don't allow the voices to denigrate what God has given you or your efforts to use those gifts.
Yes to the bridges. You aren't going to conquer this in one sudden lightbulb moment when all suddenly becomes clear. It takes time to get over those unkind comments. Give yourself that time.
Lots of thoughts:
1. Fabulously beautiful photos today
2. You are thinking so deeply, a rare and welcome thing in a shallow world.
3. I have such appreciation for your honesty.
4. Someone has been beating you up for far too long.
5. That someone has PROBLEMS, which aren't your circus nor your monkeys.
6. You are reaching a great balance between gratitude and joy.
7. You are both acknowledging your gifts and using them well.
8. The Commentariat is full of wise and kind people.
I emailed you with a few more thoughts.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, problems which are not my circus or monkeys is going to now be a part of my vocabulary!
@Central Calif. Artist Jana,
Brilliantly stated.
Oh, Kristen. If only one could hug you just about now.
Thank you for trusting us with your thoughts on this. We are here to remind you that you are not small; that you are not boastful when you congratulate yourself about your successes; that whatever the source of your erroneous self-thoughts, you can overcome them.
You have presented some very logical and thoughtful ways to create a bridge. Humbly, from my own experience with this and other personality aspects, I would say that the key is possibly to replace the negative self-criticism with positive affirmations about yourself. THe idea is of course, to drown out those inner voices.
From my experience and that of others, that is the key. Congratulations on identifying these limiting thoughts and beliefs. Now, one might consider digging very deep on how they came about. Usually is is either how one is raised and the people around one who signal how you are to behave and/or the religious teachings one is exposed to. I do not wish to hurt or judge you or your religion but it seems from the very words you have written, that there may be roots in one's religion that is then reinforced by one's nuclear family. Respectfully, you may hang on to these limiting and negative thoughts about yourself because to let go, you may feel as if you are abandoning values/rules you were taught.
No person, no group, organization can make us feel small unless we go along. And if we go along, we have to ask why. Just as men and women must examine the state of their marriages/partnerships to determine whether they can stay or go. So many get trapped because they believe all sorts of things that a spouse or partner has told them about themselves.
It is truly sad that in 2024, so many women, in particular, are still hearing and allowing the voices of criticism to drive their lives.
You have taken the first important step: To recognize that the voices are WRONG. That
you have nothing to be ashamed of by congratulating and rewarding yourself for your success.
The fact that someone in your life has told you that you were studying to get attention? OMG. I don't know who that was, but I wouldn't believe a thing out of their mouth and I would seriously have to ask them where that kind of criticism was coming from.
I have watched women doubt their decisions time and again: In families, at work, everywhere. Why? Because over time they heard and accepted as true, false criticism of themselves. (And, interestingly, if you've ever met a true narcissist for whom such criticism might truly apply, they feel no guilt, no shame and are beyond "prideful."
Being proud is not being prideful. Intellectually you know that. But somewhere, there are those voices. Root them out. Consider the source and why they exist. Then, give them no power.
I can only imagine how much criticism you may have received even from loved ones as you made your decision to end your marriage. And how hard that must be/have been. BUT...you knew in your heart what you had to do. And you did it. And you should congratulate yourself for the courage to leave what was clearly unhealthy (I'm trying hard not to use the T word here because I do not know your situation.)
I have watched painfully, over the years as my sister in law has gone through hell with my own brother. Finally, Finally, she "woke" up and started to reclaim her life (and her literal health) though he still makes trouble for her. I share what she said to me when after decades of hell, she finally left. She had met someone who actually treated her well (a friend turned more over time, thankfully she and my brother are NOT married) and she said: "I never thought someone could really love me." (This because of years of emotional and financial abuse from my brother) This is what gave her the courage to finally move on. She is, by the way, the rock of her family and the kindest, most generous, most loving soul I've ever encountered who we all praised over the years to encourage her to not settle. She's still got stuff to work through but she realizes she had erroneous beliefs about herself that came from her family and its religious followings.
Right now, I want to say to you: Congratulations. You have recognized that you have been hearing voices of criticism that have NOTHING TO DO WITH WHO YOU ARE. You are choosing to change that and are moving ahead. KEEP GOING. DON'T STOP.
It's a journey you are on that is huge in many ways. Never ever let anyone, no matter how much you love and respect them, tell you who you are. Seriously. Women for some reason make this mistake a lot for numerous reasons, but a lot because they are people pleasers. Funny, how folks who could care less how others feel manage to enjoy their lives a lot more (Not saying that all of those folks don't care about others, but rather that they do not allow anyone else to tell them who they are.)
There are a number of great books out there that address this overall issue (allowing one's self to be defined by others or other principles)
Good luck And please you have just killed it your first year in classes. It is not easy at any age but at this stage, YES YES YES. You, go. If we were friends in real life, I'd be throwing you a party of one sort or another to celebrate. Go, KRISTEN!
I felt sad reading your post that you have these voices in your head telling you to be small. The word “prideful” is such a Christian term - I dont even know why one should not feel pride when one accomplishes something big and hard. Even something small like when I look around a clean kitchen I feel proud of myself for doing it. I think maybe if you feel pride when you have put in the work then its ok? Feeling proud of being wealthy when its not money you made yourself would be the opposite for example.
This post is timely, and I'd like to offer up some observations outside of the religious view that you are struggling with.
I, too, am a Christian. I understand THAT bit of where your brain is.
However, an additional part that I think you may be struggling with is also this: women who are intellectually gifted often have Imposter Syndrome.
I am no clinician, but I am a teacher and I also teach gifted students on the regular and your struggles are pretty classic of what my gifted teenage girls struggle with---both my students and my own daughters.
Your words here are actually some of the very things my own 17-year-old daughter struggles with. She cheers for others more loudly than any other person I know, while constantly worrying that she is bragging all the while pushing herself harder than any person I know.
Adding to this, is her constant fear that people think she's arrogant.
I do this too, for the record. I am constantly looking over my shoulder, worried that I am too proud, that my tone is arrogant, etc.
The reality is that God wishes for us to use the talents He gave us. If we do, and we do so fully, our talents and skills amplify others and lift them up.
Your care and concern for others' successes is genuine. That you actually WORRY about being prideful is proof that you are not.
Now, I'm going to go take my own advice. Yesterday I was offered a job that I don't feel I deserve, and immediately I was filled with worry that I couldn't juggle everything and help my children too.
I'm going to shake that off. Thank you for your very real, very timely and very Godly post.
I am not religious, but can see such an argument being framed in terms of privilege. I also say it can be both. I can acknowledge that I have a good job and security because I was given good choices in the first place....but it doesn't negate the fact that I worked hard to get where I am. Or that I can't help others who don't have the same opportunities.
In terms of religion, I always like Madeleine L'Engle's belief that we glorify God by living and making use of His gifts, if that's what you believe. Being proud of what you do with them doesn't mean you're 'prideful' or self-centred. It means you are enjoying the gifts God gave you and are celebrating Him (or whatever pronoun you prescribe/don't prescribe). The very profession you are entering is dedicated to helping others!
Finally, to echo some others here, this seems more of a female issue. Women are always taught to be quieter and 'not boastful'. Men are never taught to make themselves smaller.
@Sophie in Denmark, and to add another thought - even if you weren't working to be part of a service profession, that wouldn't mean you should therefore not be proud of yourself! We can be proud of ourselves for any kind of hard work.
I thought about that too...that if you go to an extremist view when it comes to privilege, you could easily get to the same place I'm in, just without the religious piece!
@Sophie in Denmark, If it makes you feel better about the coming generation, I always teach my sons (and daughters) not to be arrogant. I teach them not to make others feel little by making themselves seem bigger/better. I hope they soak at least some of that up.
I have been sober 36 years. My sobriety date is October 1, 1987. I was 23. My sponsor says I have an obligation to get birthday chips and tell my story with pride and joy because someone might be listening and say to themselves, "If she can get sober at 23, maybe I can as well." Although I believe my achievements are a grace from God I also believe I can take pride in accepting the gifts and doing the footwork. The footwork is what I have control over. I think of the ripple effects of my work: my son has never seen his mother drink. Thousands of children have had a sober teacher striving everyday to be of service. The roads were safer because there was one less drunk driver on them. Dozens of women I have sponsored have been shown proof there is a new way to live. My mother, who was and alcoholic for 50 years. took a one year sobriety chip at 79 years old in the same church I took mine in. She now has 10 years. My program is one of attraction rather than promotion.
God doesn't make junk. God doesn't make anything small. We might perceive it as small but that is false humility. My bridge thought: Feeling joy and wonder is the first step of any beautiful revolution.
Awww, this is an amazing accomplishment! Good for YOU!!
I think that you should try not to think about grades, etc. too much. After a few days you will just think that you passed and not that you did so well. In other words you are over thinking in my view and after a while you will just accept things and go on with your life.
This is such a beautifully written and honest post. You are taking steps into what may be some of the hardest work of your life – unpacking voices that were installed in your brain at a very early age. I have a few thoughts:
1. I grew up in a moderate Baptist church – not fundamentalist – but somebody close to me was raised with much more conservative religious beliefs. This became an issue when those beliefs fed into destructive obsessive thinking. After much therapy and self reflection, the person close to me was able to adjust their beliefs into a more helpful way of thinking. A good professional therapist can be extremely helpful in learning how to quiet internal voices that no longer have any purpose in your life, if they ever did.
2. Pride is a sin if it is destructive. Acknowledging to yourself that your hard work has brought about success is not destructive.
3. We are commanded to “love your neighbor as yourself.” This means that loving yourself is one of the primary commandments. Would you talk to anyone you loved the way that these voices are talking to you? Would you allow somebody else to talk to someone you loved the way that these voices are talking to you?
Something that my father - a lifelong devout non-fundamentalist Baptist - once said to me, has stuck with me forever. He said that in his opinion what God really cares about is how we treat other people. That’s all.
As an aside, so much of conservative theology is designed to control women. But if you read the gospels – not the letters of Paul, but the gospels – that is the antithesis of what Jesus did.
To your last paragraph: yes. I don't know what the motives are of the people in charge, or what their hopes are, ideally speaking, but I can definitely say that on the ground, in practice, it does tend to control women a lot.
Kristen, I found this post very relatable. What you are describing is 100% me. I have spent my whole life cheering on friends and my own children and husband, all the while keeping my own accomplishments quiet. I always atttributed that to my emotionless mother, who never cheered us kids on. I once had a colleague who was like a mother figure to me, compliment me on something, and I as I was poo-pooing it, she stopped me, and said “Brenda, learn how to take a compliment. Just say thank you and enjoy it!” This does not come naturally for some of us, and I blame my upbringing. No matter, I am very proud of you and your 4.0 , you have every right to relish that and I’m glad you do! Enjoy your summer vacation!
Aww, I am so sorry. It is super tough to be missing that from your mom! I am sending you a virtual hug. <3
I was going to say: satisfaction or even joy at good results is not the same as being prideful about the results. And then you said just that.
To add to that: I do often say that God gave me (or my kids) a good brain and I’m very glad that I am (or my kids are) using it as intended. Some people don’t, and that’s sad.
And then also let me add that the spectrum of evangelical Christianity includes such a range of teaching/culture on this, and I’ve come to think that any extremity isn’t going to be right thinking. I regret that the extremes often result in the rest of the spectrum being disregarded, and also in individual damage, which is absolutely not in the “love your neighbor” category. (My brain does such a good job of self-castigation all by itself that I would always prefer to skip Ash Wednesday and Good Friday services because it will put me in a funk for days, and we are very low on the “depravity” scale.) I specifically regret for you that you’re in that position.
I wrote my comment before reading others’ words and honestly can’t love this community enough.
!! Thank you for posting this. I immediately felt so many connections to what you wrote. Please know I'll be reading this again. I appreciate the chance to co-ponder from afar. !!
Aww, I am so glad it resonated with you. <3
I thought you might find this interesting . It’s written by an eating disorders therapist but I think the concept broadly applies: https://www.karenrkoenig.com/blog/authentic-versus-hubristic-pride
You have never bragged to us. You always express gratitude for the gifts you have and make the most of them with efforts you should be proud of, and you make the human best of all situations. Kristen, continue to take pleasure in doing your best and accomplishing worthy goals. The role model you are is making a difference.
and sorry but I have to say it. GOD DIDN'T GIVE ME MY BRAIN. Random meiosis did. God didn't give me a work ethic--I did. Because I didn't want to be like my lackadaisical parents with little to no ambition or drive.
Whenever I get the urge to say something unkind to myself, I reframe it as’Would I ever say that to a friend or would I stand quietly by, while the friend said it to herself’. If the answer is no!, then the same standard should apply to me. It has been so effective in helping me be gentle with myself.
I understand the theology you are talking about. And part of how you view this is spot on with my beliefs. But let me suggest a "bridge thought." Remember the parable of the 3 servants and the talents? God gave you a great brain and a great work ethic, right. But just because He gave them to you, doesn't mean you had to use them the way you have. The 3rd servant did nothing with his talent.
However, servants 1 and 2 used theirs, and were given MORE, as well as a "well done." That's where I see you--as doing the best you can with what God gave you, and in doing so, you honor Him. And as one of your spiritual gifts seems to be an Encourager, you have the qualities and results to back that up.
Kristen, please consider reading the book titled Worthy by Jamie Kern Lima as you continue to sort out your thoughts on this topic.
Thank you for the suggestion!
I hope you are able to keep the good and leave the bad in terms of theology. John Calvin apparently (not that I'm an expert, but he wrote a great deal) didn't spend his days writhing on the floor as a result of his thinking. I doubt God is glorified if a person denigrates his good gifts! You are using yours to good effect!
Prov. 18.17 He that is first in his own cause seemeth just;
also to theology that emphasizes my nothingness, my unworthiness, and my total depravity.
Perhaps you need to look at that theology with fresh eyes and see if what you have been taught stands up Biblically.
This lecture series may give you a new perspective.
https://www.thenarrowpath.com/topical_lectures.php?v01#Gods_Sovereignty_and_Mans_Salvation
First of all, I'm so sorry that you have been told these things "that you are not worthy, that you need to be small." And "that credit is to be given to others (including God)."
Being happy/excited/grateful that you not only completed a not easy task, but you did it very well (which as many others know is not the case for everyone) is not wrong. You have worked hard/put in effort & adjusted your life to do something not only for yourself, but for others. Being prideful is not the same as being self centered, not by a long shot.
Yes you have a gift of helping others, but you do it in with love, not as an attempt to receive recognition or praise. You work hard to do what you need to do, which is often times more than other people in your class because you are at a different point in your life than others (& that's ok, actually it's an inspiration to some others). You should feel no shame in being happy with all of your accomplishments, you are doing nothing wrong with being happy about your success. It is well deserved & should be celebrated just as you celebrate the success of others.
Please know that you are very much loved (my many more than you probably know) just for being you---the person who you are authentically. You deserve joy & happiness just as much as others & that no matter what others think you should do, YOU DO WHAT YOU FEEL/KNOW YOU SHOULD DO!
I hope that as time goes on that you find those meaningful bridges that bring you the acceptance that you seek.
Kristen, keep being you. 🙂
Please take God out of the equation for just one minute and admit to yourself: I DID THIS! I was raised in the old-fashioned punitive Catholic church by a woman who was a converted Southern Baptist, so she was a great believer in heaven and hell. Even on her deathbed she was convinced that she hadn't been good enough to go to heaven.
I don't think that's the way to live a good life, to always be just a little afraid. I don't think anything's wrong with working very hard, achieving great success, and being happy with your success.
In high school my class valedictorian once said, "I took all the easy classes because I wanted good grades." Don't be that girl -- be the person who takes calculus instead of Algebra 1, who challenges herself to succeed, who works very hard, and who doesn't apologize for her success.
I think you have to redefine the words "pride" and "proud" and recognize your achievement. Plain and simple. YOU DID IT!!
Timely post for me. For some reason I'm remembering many things I've said in my life that I am now thinking "I bet that sounded really arrogant." Or "they thought I'm really prideful." And feel8ng shame. You nailed it in this post for me. This comes from being taught I must be self-less and self negating. Societal forces on girls and women are very powerful.
It took my YEARS to realize how much work and determination it took me to get through by bachelor's. Even now, 30 years later, when I see my children going through college I am so proud of myself that I was able to make it through my difficult classes. At the time I brushed off my accomplishments as 'no big deal' and 'well, I did have to go to summer classes just to keep up' and 'I'm lucky I had a good teacher/classmates/etc'.
It took a ton of hard work and grit for me to do that and I am so proud of myself!
Is it his past words that remind you to stay small, quiet, unobtrusive, in the corner?
When someone in our life is not supportive of steps we want to take to improve our lives, our community and our spirit, it is their smallness that they are imparting on you.
Kristen - you have a beautiful gift and it must be shared and utilized for the good of your community. Please hold up your head, smile and acknowledge the hard work that you're doing right now. Leaving an abusive relationship takes countless measures of independent strength. Providing for your household/family with this blog that enables you to gracefully go it alone, thank you very much! I do not think it is boastful or self serving.
You bring such a light, joy and gratefulness to this blog/community. Thank you!
@Blue Gate Farmgirl, "To belittle is to be little".
Wise advice: Don't should on yourself, and don't let anyone else should on you.
This is only tangentially related to something I am mulling over related to "Biblical womanhood" and being a "godly mother." My life looks different than the ideal that teenage Rebekah envisioned. I think I'm on the right track but it took some counseling and a supportive husband to figure out that there isn't just one type of biblical womanhood or godly mothers (read Judges 4-5 for a good shock--those women are praised for their deeds).
Kristen, thank you for your transparency in your struggles. I am SO PROUD of you. It is a good thing to be diligent and to enjoy the rewards (good grades) of your hard work.
I read your post earlier today before there were any comments, but I needed to digest it for a while because it really resonated with me.
I didn’t grow up in a religious household, but at home there was a similar way of thinking as I feel you’re saying with attributing personality traits to God.
I have always been a quick learner with a conscientious personality and there was something like a silent agreement in my family that my achievements didn’t count as much as my brothers who didn’t find as much joy in school and studies. Nevermind that I worked hard for my grades.
Or small things like doing chores at home. Since it was no hassle to get me to do them it was never an acknowledgement when they were done. While my brothers often got a physical “price” in addition to encouraging words in an attempt to motivate.
It took me many years to identify the reason behind why I don’t applaud my own hard work like I do with my friends and still now after I know why it’s really hard to break the pattern.
The thing that works best for me is that I think of what I would say to a friend who had the same achievement or if a friend would have the same struggles. Sometimes when I realize the staggering difference in how I talk to myself versus to a friend it feels like my breath has been taken away. But at least it’s a conciliation for me with my personality that with hard work it will get better eventually, lol.
I don’t know if that will be any help for you Kristen as it’s quite the opposite of your “rule”, but as you write at the end, perhaps it will help you feel a bit less alone in these thoughts.
Oh, that is very interesting! I am also a person who always follows the rules, does what's expected, and rarely needed to receive discipline of any sort.
I'm sending you love and sympathy, and I hope that you and I can both make some progress in having a realistic view of what we do!
Boy, someone was really hunting for a way to be critical when they said something as idiotic as, “You are just going to nursing school for the attention you will get.” I am sorry it pained you because when I read it, I laughed out loud at such a ridiculous notion---not so much as it being said about you but as a comment about nurses or going for higher education. (I could never have gotten enough attention to compensate for the hours I spent studying!) I am so sorry that you cannot feel unbridled joy at your accomplishments, that you have been taught that erasing yourself is necessary or healthy.
There are multiple reason that it stung so bad, but one is that I had just thoroughly explained, from my heart, the reason I wanted to go to nursing school and become a nurse. So to then be told that I don't even know my own reasons, and that my reasons were so self-centered...it really hurt, especially because it was, in my observation, meant to try to keep me from going to school.
I can usually chuckle now at the ridiculousness, but I think there is still a little sore spot in my heart from that one.
@Kristen, seems that the little sore spot is from having your deep feelings and desires get bulldozed over. That situation was just Messed Up, and the speaker was Messed Up, spilling all his/her insecurities and petty jealousy and fears all over you. Ugh. He/she better be glad that the Commentariat hasn't fully unleashed on him/her, because man, oh man, there would be some stuff hitting the fan!
I’ve had many negative self thoughts that would recur often. Things that really should not have been important enough to pop into my head, but they chiseled away at my self worth. Logically I could not shake them.
I’ve been working with a therapist and utilizing a strategy called EMDR. It’s been very helpful!
Yes! My therapist is EMDR trained so we do that sometimes.
Kristen,
Soooo many thoughts on this. I so recognize The Voices telling you things that aren't necessarily true (having lived with depression my entire life, this is exactly what depression does, at least in part - it tells your brain lies, and you believe the lies. I am *not* saying you are depressed, just pointing out a similarity). I have less than pleasant memories of my parents - my mom especially - telling me, when I got a B in math one semester, with the rest of my grades all A's - "well, you'll just have to bring up that grade next semester". (Huge eyeball roll).
I love the idea of Bridge Thoughts, and I think you've come up with some very useful ones for yourself. I read them, and they reflected what I was thinking, reading your post.
It will take time to change those voices, but it will happen!. You have never come across as a person who wants to be "better" than your fellow students; you have cheered them on the whole way, studied with them, encouraged them, and I assume they have done the same for you (including joking about "the other Kristen" who raises her hand and asks questions. ;-)) Yes, you want to succeed, and you work incredibly hard to make that happen - BUT you also celebrate your fellow classmate's achievements as well! God may have given you your good brain, and your work ethic, etc. etc., but you took those gifts and RAN with it, putting in lots of hours, doing the work, doing the clinicals, labs, and everything else. NO ONE gave you your excellent grades, a GPA of 4.0, and the skills and knowledge you have gained.
Another thought - if you didn't tell us here in the Commentariat about your school success, we'd all be asking about it! We are all here for you, and cheering you on from near and far.
I'm sure there are other things I haven't thought of that I want to say, but my lunch break is over. 🙂 I do love your photos.....there's something magical about rain drops on leaves.
Please keep working to silence those Voices. You are worthy. You are loving. You worked hard and helped your peers. WWJD? He'd be mighty pleased with you.
Having compassion for oneself is hard, it sounds like you may be having some negative self talk. Sharing this with a therapist or in the divorce group ( I thought at some point you mentioned a support group you were in) maybe super beneficial. I think sometimes it’s easier to be kinder to others than ourself. You have come a long way and deserve to celebrate that. On another note someone else is always going to have more hardships or worse days do not let that diminish yours as they are valid too! hugs 🙂
Yes! Definitely gonna talk to my therapist about this.
@Kristen, I think your therapist would benefit from reading your blog!
Haha, she does sometimes!
Hello Kristen! Thank you for sharing this post with so much vulnerability. I can't help but wonder about the relational dynamics of your marriage that contributed to you feeling this way. I've recently learned about a therapy modality called Internal Family Systems, and read an intro book called "No Bad Parts: Healing Trauma & Restoring Wholeness with the Internal Family Systems Model" by Richard C. Schwartz. The basic premise is that we all have internal "parts" - i.e. your voices - that are often very young pieces of ourselves stuck in a past trauma that play specific roles, namely keeping us safe. I'd interpret the voices telling you not to be proud as voices that are trying to protect you from any blowback or danger if you did express pride in previous relationships, whether it be with your ex-husband or adults in your childhood. I have lots of parts, and think of them as pieces of me sitting around the conference table in my head, battling over who gets to direct my life :).
The cool thing is we have the ability to heal these inner parts by consistently noticing them, asking them what they are afraid of happening if they didn't keep doing what they are doing, and what they need in the future, and then reminding them how old we are now, that we are safe, and helping to give them what they need. It's a bit more detailed than that but I would highly encourage the book as a tool to create new bridges to healing. And I really resonated with your bridge thought about wanting everyone to do well. There's a quote from the late Paul Wellstone that "We all do better when we all do better."
Sending you a lot of self-compassion and grace! You got this.
Oh, that's so funny because Natalie Hoffman, who I mentioned in this post, loves Schwartz's work with IFS.
And yes, over this past week I have been thinking about what small inner parts are talking to me.
Generally I find people that are critical of someone tend to be unhappy with themselves in that area of their lives. Unless someone is genuinely trying to be kind and gentle and helpful in their criticism it says a lot more about them than the person they're criticizing. More than one thing can be true - you may be privileged and have people to thank along the way, and also you should be SO PROUD of yourself!!
Yes. Sometimes when people critique you, they are saying something about themselves.
I think it can be both. Yes, God gave you a good brain and parents who raised you with a good work ethic, and then you were faithful with those gifts and turned them into the beautiful fruit of good results.
I tink it sometimes it's hard to have a proper definition for the word proud now that "haughty" is antiquated, but I like the distinction -- I think you can absolutely be proud of your achievements, so long as you're not haughty and think you're better than others (which you clearly don't!).
Well done, Kristen!
Some of the things you have written, both today and in the past, have led me to think that in your past, some people have portrayed our God as one who stands in judgement at all times and is all law.
I believe God did / does provide all that you mentioned - he gave you your many gifts, your desire to help others, ability to study, remember, etc. but YOU are responsible for how you chose to use the gifts he gave you. YOU chose to honor God with your study habits, with taking the time to share your knowledge and time with classmates to further their chances of success. YOU did all this while providing a loving home for your children that are still in your home. You chose to hold your head high and navigate incredibly tough circumstances. You chose to keep hurtful details to yourself, as you knew it may hurt others you love. None of these actions speak of being prideful. Pride puts self above all others. You constantly choose to show grace and love to others.
As a sinner, I know that I am not worthy of the grace and mercy God shows me. But, BUT GOD SO HIGHLY VALUES and LOVES US, He sent His Son to bear our sin burden. Jesus conquered the cross and death so that God now only views us in the righteousness of Jesus. It is a gift to us. We cannot earn it. You, nor anyone, is worthless in God's sight. He would not have sent His Son to be a sacrifice for us, to pay our sin debt, if we hadn't meant everything to Him.
I hope that your heart continues to heal and grow and to know that you are so very loved, valued, and worthy of all blessings! I hope that you come to feel that you can acknowledge all the twists and turns in your life, and feel pride in how you handled yourself, the hard work you put in, and that you deserve every happiness. <3
You know what's interesting...I rarely feel this in a vertical sense, as in, about God. It's more of a horizontal problem. Feeling a heavy weight of earthly expectations and burdens.
@Kristen, it's really hard, but when my horizontals are my issue, focusing on my vertical truth helps the most. hold tight to the truth and speak it out loud to keep those horizontal voices from getting you down!
(hugs)
As a longtime reader, fellow homeschooling mom (retired), and woman who once (long-ago) escaped a bad marriage - healing takes a lot of time. Give yourself grace and then more grace.
(hugs) again.
I try to remind myself of that when I get discouraged; it did not take a short amount of time to get hurt this much, and it will not take a short amount of time to heal, no matter how hard I try to do all the healing things.
Thank you.
A book worth checking out: Negotiating The Inner Peace Treaty. I am a conservative Christian Woman who also struggles/ed with the "shoulds" and "oughts". This book for me was life changing. Even if it isn't that impactful for you there is still a lot of wisdom to be gleaned and questions that evoke deep reasoned and faithful reflection.
https://www.amazon.com/Negotiating-Inner-Peace-Treaty-Becoming/dp/1452544042
With all you have gone through and are still going through, you should be proud of yourself! (Nursing is an intense curriculum.) You have held your head up, kept moving forward, and never lost sight of your goal. You have had rough days, but the good days far outnumber them! You are awesome!
-read this comment with the tune of Sisters of Mercy`s More-
You have been conditioned to feel like you feel now. Whoever it did, it did them a purpose.
So stop right now beeing so useful to people that use you.
It takes practice: start with a day where you start all your sentences with: I!
Tell yourself every day that you love yourself, no matter what. Then, after a few weeks, you will feel the change coming.
You are free off other peoples minds, hopefully.
Enjoy. Only then you can give back all the good , because the well needs to be replenisht.
You are on such a good path in your live right now, don`t let anything get in your way.
Pay close attention, and you'll know whose voice it is (it could be multiple close ones with one being the loudest). Xx.
I read your blog almost daily, but never comment. This one struck something within. Nursing school is hard! It’s ok to be proud. You were not boastful. You did not act like you were better than anyone else. People that read your blog know you are grateful and thankful. You let Jesus shine through you! Look in the mirror and give yourself credit. I bet you thank God everyday for something.
Hi Kristen,
Congratulations on a fantastic job in your latest semester of nursing school! We have never met in person, but I am so proud FOR YOU! God may have given you the tools, but you applied the effort and elbow grease to succeed. To anyone , including the voices, I say “sit down and shut up ; no one asked for your opinion!”
When I read today’s post I wanted to cry. Every word you wrote about making yourself less or smaller hit so many of my pain points. ‘Nice girls’, ‘good girls’ don’t take credit. They give credit to the group. Women are taught this in every facet of our society…I won’t go into the rant building in my head but I want to ask “Why” why aren’t we worthy of recognition? I’m not talking about braggarting (made up word) - but being justifiably proud of our accomplishments.
I spent most of my life being a good girl. Then I got pancreatic cancer and survived. I decided that if I wasn’t proud of myself & my accomplishments, why would anyone else value my efforts?
Nursing is probably one of the hardest careers I’ve ever observed or been on the receiving end of… The nurses were the ones who interpreted the doctors’ words when I was too tired to interrogate the doctor. The nurses held my hand every time I asked and still do when I’m scared (which is a lot). The nurses were my advocates when my family couldn’t be with me. All of my hospital experiences were determined by the nurses and their care and concern.
As to the Voices and Bridging Thoughts:
1. When the Voices start up, ask yourself why these Voices are piping up? What do they gain by denigrating you? My Greek Chorus usually wants control and power. They feel better by making me feel bad. I spend a lot of time inviting my Greek Chorus to take a long walk off a very short pier.
2. Ask yourself if you would ever speak to your daughters or your classmates the way the Voices are talking to you? What would you do if you overheard a stranger talking to your girls in that manner? (I know what I would do, but I’m pretty sure it’s a felony.). If you wouldn’t speak to your girls or your colleagues that way , why is it acceptable to speak to yourself that way?
I know this is all over the place, please forgive me. There’s a lot of edited, unladylike language that doesn’t show up.
You are the only FrugalGirl Kristen. God made exactly one of you. You are allowed to be proud of how you have continued Her (;-)) initial work. She’s certainly proud of you. Big virtual hugs!!!! KtB
Hi Kristen! I’ve been reading your blog for at least a decade! I have some book suggestions that helped me around the topic of goodness and worthiness: Good Inside by Dr Becky Kennedy and Failing Upwards by Father Richard Rohr. The church can give us a feeling of not being worthy bc we need Jesus, but I think it can go too far sometimes. I think it leaves a lot of people feeling bad about themselves in some way. I don’t think Jesus thinks that about us - we were created in his image. I hope you can feel good about your accomplishments because you put in so much effort to accomplish them! Yes you have some privilege in your life, but you acknowledge it. You still put in a tremendous amount of time and effort. That counts for so much!!
I know that some people seem to be able to take on this theology and not feel crushed by it. But that is apparently not me!
Retired university professor here and lifelong student of behavior … I’ve reviewed a lot of transcripts in my career and interviewed students for admission into graduate school. Here’s my take on grades, which has to do with why you want to get good grades and what they mean to you; that is, intrinsic versus extrinsic reinforcement.
Why do you want good grades? When you want a good grade as a means of verifying your personal learning goals and achievement, that’s intrinsic reinforcement. In other words, you work hard in order to satisfy yourself. When you want a good grade because someone will praise you or you’ll get some kind of reward (think parents who reward their children with an established monetary reward for A’s), that’s extrinsic reinforcement. You do the work in order to get something outside of your self.
That’s not to say that earning a particular GPA because it opens the door to a scholarship or an admission into a desired program/career is always extrinsically motivated. Someone can work very hard to achieve a GPA in order to achieve their end goal. The satisfaction though should come from inside yourself, not the promise of a lucrative career.
If I’m interviewing you for a nursing job and I see a high GPA, first of all, I will know the demands of those classes. Doing well will indicate to me you took your coursework seriously and you have the ability to study, retain information, and apply it. What the GPA won’t tell me is if you have the heart for nursing or the “soft” skills. A grade less than an “A” also doesn’t tell me if you actually don’t know the material as well. There could have been other issues come up, which influenced your grade.
I have had students who really want an A, but don’t want to put the work in. Being intrinsically motivated requires a great deal of self-discipline, which I think you have. You have every reason and right to be proud of what you’ve accomplished. Letting people know your results allows for a community celebration and provides an opportunity for being a role model.
I struggled similarly with using “Dr.” Was I being prideful? I came to the conclusion I wanted girls, especially young girls, to know a doctorate (PhD) was obtainable and not just for men. I hoped to be a positive example. I earned the degree and in the institutions I worked, using the title was part of the culture.
Perhaps, you could put the negative voices in time out!
Reflection is a powerful practice. Keep it up. And, as many have said … I’d rather have you for a nurse because you’ve approached this so seriously and done your very best!
I'd say I'm intrinsically motivated to get good grades. No one else, including all my professors, has ever suggested that getting A's in nursing school is a helpful or reasonable goal. lol So...it's just me.
I'm sorry but I cannot wrap my head around your mindset. All that keeps looping through my brain is "holy crap, this girl has been seriously brainwashed". And my logical self knows this came from years of brainwashing, it was not overnight.
So from me - female whose parents knew what our small town was like and made sure I did not get sucked into the mire, female who has always worked in a male dominated field - it is good, okay, more than okay to feel good about what you did, ON YOUR OWN. Like it or not, I hope I live long enough to see the end of life-sucking religions of not only the US, but the world. I see more and more men who are not scared of competent women. May the trend continue. And yes, the "nothing to do with me" brainwashing comes from those indoctrinated that society can only survived if ruled by patriarchs.
Think back - how many times did you hear you were a "good girl"?
I'm not saying dump your religious views - just widen your views and thoughts.
Nursing school is a hard journey. You deserve accolades as well as a sense of being proud.
I had an interesting experience with my students the other day. I handed back papers they had worked hard on, and that had gone through three revisions, and the final products were so much better than their first drafts. They still were not perfect or even excellent, and most students got a B or B+, but they were good and the fruit of a lot of hard work (on both our parts!) and I was really proud of them and told them that. But so many of them saw the B and were like “Really? We got a B and you are proud?” Because to them the grade is the thing to be proud of, not the effort. But I don’t really see a reason to be proud of an A you didn’t work for. Thankful, yes, but not proud. But if you worked hard and the fruit of that effort was an A (or a B or even a C) then you have something to be proud of.
Agreed on the effort! If I took a first grade math exam and got an A, I would not feel any sort of deep satisfaction from that. But taking on a hard task and putting all my effort in? That feels deeply satisfying.
This comment might get buried, but I felt very much that it was worthy of writing in case you do see it. I want to suggest, the next time you're pondering, that perhaps you ponder a couple words.
Why yes, I am about to make this about semantics. But as a writer you know that words are powerful things.
First I want you to consider that the word Pride has evolved over time. I've included a Webster's Dictionary link on the matter. But the jist is: when the Bible was penned, the word Pride had a different definition. It meant, specifically, excessive self-esteem. It had connotation of conceit. As one of the deadly sins the word often appeared capitalized, Pride. In the 14th century it evolved a new meaning: a reasonable amount of self-respect. Nowadays it is a polysemous word: a word with multiple meanings. In modern english it can switch between positive and negative connotations.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/wordplay/pride-meaning-word-history#:~:text=In%20its%20original%20sense%2C%20pride,of%20the%20seven%20deadly%20sins.
I wonder if it might be a useful bridge for you to start thinking of Pride and pride as two different things. "Pride" is excessive self-esteem and conceit, and pride is reasonable self-respect.
I also want to suggest that you to explore of the concept of Deference: humble submission and respect / respect and esteem due a superior or an elder. A lot of your self-talk around this issue seems to revolve around deferring to God, a partner, a parent. It might be helpful to think about what that means to you, who you're willing to defer to and what you're willing to defer.
Thank you! And yes; my life has definitely had a theme of deference, to a fault, and I am in the midst of trying to figure out a better balance.
You can be both. Maybe it might help to stop using the word 'pride' because it has some negative associations.
I tend to use the rather UK and very old fashioned phrase 'well chuffed' which means, to me, both extremely happy about what's happened, satisfied with myself that I helped to make it happen and thankful for those who helped it to happen.
'Pride' (the negative interpretation, not as in 'I'm proud of you' though), to me, means being puffed up and full of one's own self importance to the exclusion of giving anyone else any credit and you are so far from that you couldn't be any further.
Maybe turn that great saying around and love yourself as much as you so obviously and genuinely love others. Not saying you don't but maybe just in this particular area?
Lots of love. xxx
Hi, I really appreciate this post, I bet you are not alone here in this struggle! Your experience really reminded me of the opening chapters of a book “Playing Big” by Tara Mohr. I am reading and listening to it right now, ahead of a Best of Both Worlds book club. It’s a much more spiritual book than I was expecting, with a beautiful approach toward managing those “inner critic” voices we all hear. I don’t feel I have the solution seen up but that book might be helpful to you, it’s definitely given me lots of inspiration and a new framework to use to be kind to myself. Congratulations on your grades!!
Hi Kirsten,
Just here to say, being unkind is being unkind, regardless of whom the unkindness is directed towards. We all know you are kind. There is no loophole that makes being merciless towards yourself okay behavior. Tell that to the Voices, and be firm with them.
Cheering for you and with you!!! <3
I was just thinking that this raw, honest post was going to receive a huge number of comments and I see there are already over 100! It is healthy ask ourselves these questions, but not healthy to beat ourselves up over them. Sending huge, warm 《HUGS!》your way!
God has blessed you with unique talents and opportunities, and He is at the heart of your success. Recognizing His role in your achievements and giving Him the glory doesn’t diminish your hard work—it amplifies it. You can be proud of what you’ve accomplished because it’s a testament to what God can do through you.
There is a difference between being prideful and knowing your own worth. Rock on!
I appreciate you. And I feel that, with how hard you have worked, you have every right to feel pride. You mentioned a lot of very good points above; hopefully you can use those thoughts to help you feel comfortable in your accomplishments.
Kristen- you SHOULD be proud of yor accomplishment! Being proud of an accomplishment you worked had for is not the same as being prideful. You can give credit to your professors and others who helped you reach your goal and still be proud of yourself for achieving it. Consider that you didn't waste the help others gave.
My first thought when I read #3 is “yes! Me too!” One type of pride (the boastful “everyone look at me! Is everyone looking??” Type) is a sin. The other type (“I worked so hard and I’m glad I completed my goal” type) is healthy and needed. Why do we call both “pride”? I feel the healthy type needs a rebranding.
1 some of this is overflow from everyone gets a trophy, eliminating gifted programs, not grading assigned projects, no meritorious hiring or college admissions.
2 it is ok to express gratitude for certain talents
By the way why is it ok for certain talents to be so obviously lauded but those of important caretakers healthworkers to be considered prideful ??????? we should be blessed to have outstanding people caring for us when we are in such dependent states??????
One thing I have learned about myself, is that when my brain has these types of thoughts (ie being prideful, thinking too much of myself), it's a version of self protection. My young self learned that it's bad to think too much of myself, that bad things might happen to me because I'm thinking too much of myself. And so, that voice pipes up to warn me that I'm getting too big for my britches.
What I am learning to do, is to reparent myself (treating myself the way I would my own children or a friend). To give true thanks to the part of myself that is scared (I do think it would be bad for me to think I'm the best thing thing in the world and not care for others). And then to take a deep breath, to feel the fear that my young self feels about being noticed, called out, how worried she is that something bad is going to happen. And then, to use my grown up brain to talk some sense to myself.
I recently got promoted to the top leadership job in my workplace (I did not apply; someone left and I was given the job). This idea that I'm too full of myself can really get in the way of me being effective in my role, and it's honestly not true. It's just a fear that I have that I will forget what is most important to me and others as I enter this chapter. I'm trying to use it as a reminder to be present and remember what matters most.
Kristen-- everyone wants a nurse who is an expert. I find it very comforting to know that nursing students take their studies so seriously and are always looking for ways to understand and take better care of people. So when I hear that you have all As, I think it's wonderful. That's the kind of nurse I want at my bedside.
As I’ve followed your journey through your posts I’ve seen someone who wants to “do justly, love mercy and walk humbly”. I believe you want to be the best “you” possible and that includes the path to becoming a nurse. To become the best nurse possible means hard work and “all hard work is profitable” aka good grades, open doors, public acknowledgement with a “well done”. I see your school success as a mirror image of your dedication as a Mom. I smile knowing how you’ve been in your kids corners all the way. You can take great joy in that AND great joy in pursuing a career meant for heroes like yourself, in being a friend and mentor to classmates and, in the future, a caregiver to folks in need of compassionate care in the most challenging times of life.
This is such a beautiful, thoughtful post. Thank you so much for sharing it. And congratulations on doing so well in nursing school. We're all proud of you too. 😉
I just read this book blurb and thought of you:
Patient Care
By Paul Seward
“Fascinating and engrossing” (Kirkus Reviews): From a priest who refused treatment to a pharmacist haunted by a past decision, a seasoned doctor shares ethically complex stories from the emergency room in this gripping read. “In the increasingly popular medical memoir genre, this one stands out” (Booklist).
I think it helps to remember that God did not create you to be small and meaningless and worthless and nothing. He created you to succeed and triumph over your adversity. He created you in His image so that you can become everything He knows you can be. All victories however small or large move you in that direction. He gave you a smart brain and a good heart- there's nothing wrong with acknowledging your blessings and the source of them. We are meant to grateful for our gifts but we are also meant to improve our talents and that takes dedication and perseverance and plain old hard work. I think God will be the first to say, "Well done, my good and faithful servant!"
As someone who was never encouraged by my parents and told that I would never achieve anything in life, I have a voice in my head telling me that what I have achieved is not due to my efforts and is a result of luck.
You have achieved a heck of a lot in quite a short amount of time. Pride in your accomplishments may not be easy for you, and to be honest who really is able to express pride in themselves, but you should give yourself permission to be happy; happy that you are working your way through nursing school and succeeding, happy that you have a roof over your head, happy that you had the courage to strike out on your own.
Thank you!
Maybe? The Voices are not something to be pushed back, white-knuckled away, but, something to be integrated with who you are? The Voices are like a fussy child who just wants attention. So embrace the voices AND do not let them limit you or put you down. Gray, rather than black and white. There is an old saying: What you resist, persists (what you accept, transforms). Hang in there. . . .good job with your semester!
Whose voice is it that you’ve internalized ? Is it a reliable source of information?
You are not prideful or boastful or undeserving! You have accomplished all of these great grades because of hard work and dedication to do so. Do not let the devil put wrong thoughts in your head - just say "not today Satan" and choose joy. I am so proud of you and I can't wait to see what you do next! Keep up the great work.
There is a difference in being prideful and being proud.
prideful (adjective)
having an excessively high opinion of oneself:
proud (adjective) · prouder (comparative adjective) · proudest (superlative adjective)
feeling deep pleasure or satisfaction as a result of one's own achievements, qualities, or possessions or those of someone with whom one is closely associated:
Don't confuse the two. You are not prideful, you are proud of YOUR achievements and the achievements of others. You should be proud.
“Maybe it is completely morally neutral to share a joy/success with someone.”
Beyond being morally neutral to share your joy, the word says to “rejoice with those who rejoice.” If we hide our fruit (joy), no one can celebrate with us.
We see lots of biblical examples of rejoicing. And we even see God honoring David’s actions.
Doing your best and giving credit where it’s due (God for creating your brain, and you for using it well) are honorable.
Congrats on your amazing grades!
Thank you. <3
Thank you for sharing this, Kristen!