Hoarding vs. Minimalism
Edit: It will be confusing at this point if I edit the whole post, but I wish I'd thought to change this to "maximalist vs. minimalist" instead of "hoarding vs. minimalism". That would distinguish "person who has a lot of stuff" from "person suffering from OCD leading to hoarding.
Book Club Elaine sent me an email after reading this comment from Diane:
My superpower is that I am very organized. I don’t have any messy “junk drawers” & love it when people ask me to help clean out cabinetry, a pantry, etc. I see chaos & can immediately formulate a plan.
In her email, Elaine said:
How do you think about the continuum between minimalism and hoarding? Or are they in fact not polar opposites?
I don't like bare rooms or limiting my ownership of things to what can fit in a backpack, but I actually feel nauseous when I've tried to watch programs about hoarders in the past.
The post on superpowers was very thought provoking. I'm still chewing on the very first comment by Diane because I consider myself organized but I certainly have junk drawers and sometimes piles in corners. And I lose stuff. Constantly. So, I'm thinking that my system of organization is perhaps more theoretical than actual.
Elaine suggested this would make a good topic for discussion, and I agree (although honestly, most things make for good discussion topics here because you guys are such good discussers.)
Hmm. Is "discussers" a word?
Ooh, I looked it up just now, and it actually is.
So, let's get to it.
Minimalism and Hoarding on a spectrum
I do actually think that minimalism and hoarding are polar opposites, but I think there's a really big spectrum between those two extremes.
I'm guessing you, Elaine, are somewhere in the middle of the spectrum.
So to me, the fact that you are both horrified by hoarding while also not being interested in minimalism makes sense. You are happy being in between the two extremes.
It sounds like you probably want to stay somewhere in the middle, with maybe a slight shift toward minimalism (because your piles of stuff are bothering you) and organization (because you are losing things).
(The difference between minimalism and organization is probably a whole 'nother topic, actually. Because it is possible to have a lot of stuff but also keep that stuff organized. I bet most people find it easier to be organized when they have less stuff, though.)
Where do I personally land?
I am definitely not on the hoarding side of the spectrum; I'm pretty careful about how much stuff I buy, and I'm fairly consistent with getting rid of things I don't use.
This extends to my food situation also; I try to be careful not to overbuy, and I also put a lot of effort into making sure I use up what's in my fridge/freezer/pantry.
I do have some minimalist tendencies: I own only one purse, I have only two sets of work scrubs, and I have one water bottle.
On the other hand, I am not a strict minimalist. I own multiple pairs of scissors, I have an embarrassing number of hoodies, and I definitely own more than two pairs of shoes.
Also, my junk drawer is often in a state of disarray.
However, I don't lose stuff very much, and I think that's mainly because I have specific places for things.
I have to put my keys in the mug on the kitchen counter, because otherwise I will lose them.
My earbuds always go on a hook on my office bulletin board.
The charging cable for my wireless earbuds always goes in a little zippered bag in my desk drawer.
My hospital badge always goes in the same backpack on the same hook. Otherwise I could foreseeably end up at work with no badge.
Overall, I'm pretty content with where I'm at between minimalism and hoarding; my life works reasonably well for me, I usually have enough stuff, and I usually know where my stuff is!
There's not a "right" place to be on this spectrum
As with so many things in life, I don't think this is a matter of right or wrong. It's more a matter of, "Is this working for you?"
If you are happy where you're at, then I don't think you need to change anything.
One person's happy maximalist life would be someone else's idea of misery, and one person's minimalist life would be someone else's personal hell.
By the same token, some people's amount of stuff is getting in the way of their peace. And there are probably some people out there who are miserably trying to force their way into a strict minimalist way of life.
So, if that's the case for you, then maybe you need to adjust your habits to get to a better and happier place between owning too much or too little!
Readers, where do you fall on this spectrum? And are you happy with where you are?
P.S. I realize that when we commonly refer to "the spectrum" we are often referring to the autism spectrum. But that word is not specific to autism, and I couldn't think of a better word to describe what's in between hoarding and minimalism.
P.P.S. I also want to say: severe hoarding is usually a complicated problem that requires professional, compassionate help to solve.
P.P.P.S. I love the discussion ideas you guys have been sending my way. If you have one, you can always email me or leave a comment, and maybe your idea will become a post!
I think I am between Elaine and Kristen. I have a bit of clutter but not much and I don't tend to lose things. I like to have a place for everything, like Kristen. If it takes me a while to get around to giving away unneeded/unwanted items it does not bother me to have them sitting around the house, in a pile.
I am generally content with the amount of stuff we have, with a lean towards wishing we had less. I have three kids and things can accumulate quickly! Part of my problem is finding the time to find new homes for things. I'd rather things get used than trashed, so I feel better if there's someone that can use a hand-me-down as opposed to just dropping it off at a thrift store.
We are entering a season where we will have to make choices and pare down, though! My son is getting past the stage of using his Thomas the train wooden train set and his Paw Patrol toys. My kids play with Lego people more than Little People. And we're planning to move sometime this year (not towns, just into a different house because we're going to get a property that can house both us and my in-laws). Moving is a great motivator for making decisions about what to keep!
@Ruth T,
I also have 3 and it's just dealing with the tidal wave of stuff that is the thing!
My strong advice for when you move is to get rid of - covertly if necessary - a LOT more stuff than you'd otherwise be comfortable doing. I do not mean ''throw away the kettle'' but just... ya know, do not haul endless boxes of ''stuff for some day''...
Make it a watershed!
@Ruth T,
Save the trains! And the little people! A grandchild might use them someday! Get study storage totes, separate toys by type, and stack on a shelf. It's easy to find them if you have small guests over, or you could loan them out to friends. Those toys are really well made, clean easily, last forever, and represent so much $. I am not a hoarder, and most toys move on to new homes after my kids age out of them ( though, with all my kids, I got upwards of 20 yrs of use out of Thomas trains!) But I think these type are worth saving, if you have the space.
@Ruth T, We have moved and downsized several times with kids, and here is how we do it. If you can do it, I highly recommend arranging things so that you have a month where you have access to the new place while still living in the old place. Since you're moving in town, as we often have, this method might work for you. Maybe not! Ignore me if this all sounds hideous. 😉
Then: Go over and clean the heck out of the new place. (Kids just love running around in an empty house, so I always brought them along and put them to work as well.) Plan where everybody's rooms are going to be and take measurements so you know what is going where. Maybe even stock the kitchen with easy foods for moving day.
Now it's time to move to the new house while you still have at least two or three weeks in the old one. Move just the essentials to the new house: eating table, a sofa or two, mattresses, bedding, kitchen stuff, the kids' toys, (for our kids, we would give them a BIG box, label it with their name, and ask them to put their absolute favorite toys that were moving with them--reminding them that broken toys do not make the cut, but they always knew that), clothes, bathroom needs. We used to call this "camping in the new house" but of course we did have our desks and computers as well, for school.
Now it's time to clear out the old house. Start going through things like books, or other things you do not use every day. Put things you know you will want to have on hand but don't use every day (family photos, keepsakes, Christmas baking items, holiday decor, seasonal clothing that is not being worn) in boxes. WHILE you do this, make assessments about what is outgrown, worn out, or you're just plain tired of, and donate those if they're in good condition. The stuff that is good, and meaningful, comes to the new house. Everything else, unless it makes the cut, goes to donation (or if it is truly trash, to the dump). The stuff we unloaded in our last move was amazing: our kids readily went through their toys and found the broken stuff, the stuff they had outgrown, the stuff they were tired of, outgrown Halloween costumes, tired stuffed animals, and happily unloaded it.
And then your new house will have exactly the perfect stuff in it. 😉 This method means you're only going through the discard stuff ONCE, not moving it to the new house and then having to sort through it while getting settled.
(Disclaimer: nobody here has played with Thomas trains for years, but we have saved them..they're good, solid wood, and we have lots of memories, so DH wants to save them for possible grandkids down the road. The Paw Patrol stuff, however, went straight to Goodwill!)
@Karen A., I moved 15 times over 45 years, including overseas and back (twice) and to/from 6 different states. I’ve taken as little as a footlocker and as much as filled two moving vans. So much depends on what “stage of life” you’re in (and how many/few people are with you). But just about every move made me ask such questions as “where did this come from?”, “when did I get this?”, “do I really need/want this now?” and once in a while “what the heck is this for?”
@Karen A., this is so brilliant that it almost makes me want to move! I get a real kick out of getting rid of things and of course Husband is the opposite. Twenty-six years ago I adamantly proclaimed, "I AM NEVER MOVING AGAIN", and so far, so good.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, Same dynamic here. DH likes to hold onto things in case they're useful; the annoying thing is he's often proved right! 😉 But we've both managed to move a little closer to each other on the spectrum, and found balance. It was a great day when he hired a dumpster after one move to really clean out all the stuff he'd been keeping since...well, middle school. Not everything went, but a lot did!
@Ruth T, I know it's hard thinking what do I keep & how can I keep it?? We also had Thomas the train (wooden & few plastic with ALL ACCESSORIES) plus Legos & other quality educational toys.
I agree with the keep in (clear) tote idea if possible. We did for majority of same themed items which worked well for us. We stored in totes & made toy room in basement with area to pull totes out & space to use instead of leaving out in living room or dining room table.
We did eventually sell Thomas the train which made another younger family thrilled & teen made the decision & reaped the financial reward (it was originally teen toys). We still have Lego, though did sell Duplo (big Lego) because such an investment that is open to creativity at any age (which Lego has promoted in recent years).
If your family (adults) really want to save for future generations (which I did until last move/downsize) then if you can & have space then go for it. Though I would recommend keeping any paperwork/instructions also as in the future many of these will not be available. 🙂
@Ruth T, True. I have moved many times, a wonderful watershed to let go of things for many reasons. A new space calls for new thinking, and helps you clarify what is important to you.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, one of my happiness podcasts suggests that if you have a hard time with decluttering, pretend you’re going to move! Then you ask yourself with items, "Would I want to pack this to move?" and I helps.
Thanks for all of the tips for the toys and for moving! I appreciate it. We are actually thinking that we may have possession of the new house for a few months before the 5 of us have to move in. My in-laws are selling their house first and will move in first, but we won't be ready until summer. We assume that whatever we buy will need a fair amount of modifications to make it work for what we want for the two households. I'm thankful to have the prospect of being able to move things first because the thought of keeping my house show-ready with all of our kids and our stuff is really intimidating!
@Ruth T, Ooh, having the new house for a few months ahead of time sounds fabulous. We've usually just had a month, and it's doable, but a few months is even better. And then you can get established in the new place and then really clean out the old place!
@Karen A., we are moving currently, to a renovated house half a mile down the road. The cleaners come to take care of the renovation dust this Friday and the plan is to move furniture with friends on Saturday. I really appreciate this advice! It makes a lot of sense to get moved in, in camping mode, and then to start bringing over the other stuff. Thank you for sharing!
@Karen A.,
we were able to do this exact thing. I had been decluttering while we looked at house after house after house. When we finally found one, I still had more to declutter or gift to my children. We were able to bring car loads over on the way to clean, rip up carpet, and paint. In the end we only had to get one moving truck. We did end up with waaaaay less stuff (after 38 years on one house wow) but I still have a room with boxes in it.
@Karen A., The husband finished his doctorate at 28. He is now 76 and STILL is hanging on to the notes he made while working on his dissertation. I am the opposite, which is not always the smartest move either---when I finished my degrees, I threw away the diplomas, determined not to be one of those people who has a wall of diplomas. I had to order copies when my first employer wanted proof of my degrees...
@Ruth T, I had about 3 month’s overlap between houses, which were in the same city. My old house immediately so I was comfortable with owning two homes at once for a little bit. I did two things with my time:
1) Got all the work done. Well, planned to get all the work done. Contracting and houses being what they are, we found a few surprises and there was the inevitable slippage.
2) Got the library set up in advance. I moved the extra bookshelves [1]; then packed up a couple of bookshelves’ worth of books, using lots of boxes so the books were still organized; then unpacked the books in the new place, leaving empty bookshelves behind. Lather, rinse, repeat. It wasn’t quite that easy but for a good reason: I had space for more bookshelves. Instead of 10 crammed bookshelves I have 13, many with room to grow.
[1] So glad I bought extras, because both the manufacturers went out of business eventually.
@Sarah Heanssler, Good luck on your move! And full disclosure, the camping method was DH's idea originally. 😉
@mbmom11, which is why my kids played with some of my toys and wore some of the same clothes I did. But odds are I won't have any grandkids. So some of the items have been re-homed and I am eyeing others. And yes space is an issue but ever so organized, handy better half has themed storage in our basement (off the floor and a dehumidifier that runs year-round).
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, our saying is we'll be moving from here to the crematorium, haven't decided where I want my ashes spread. Better half kvetched a bit when we last moved but I reminded him of others for whom he'd done work that had far, far more than we did. The rule here is if it was mine before marriage, I make the call. I also make the call for items our kids had. Don't get me started on Holiday Barbies (dolls and matching ornaments).
Hello!
I am busy trying to excavate some of what we have accumulated since moving house back in April, so this is a very timely post! I am naturally quite chaotic and forgetful but over my life have learnt ways to manage and keep on top of that, such that I am never late and will not tolerate clutter for very long before addressing it... or it snowballs!
For me, the impulse to go and buy / acquire this or that shiny new organisational tool is there, but for environmental and thrift reasons, I have usually found I have something that will do whatever job needs doing. Not always, but 85% of the time, so it's a case of decluttering and repurposing little and often, rather than doing a huge, grand cleanup and then letting it pile up again for years. I think I'd find that overwhelming.
I'm not a minimalist, I like my stuff, but too much with inadequate storage / places for said stuff makes me antsy.
I try and sell or donate any clothing that is outgrown / unworn as quickly as is feasible too. If there are too many clothes, half of them remain unused, which is a shame.
Food is a whole other topic. I cannot, cannot bear wasting food. Yes, I do in fact throw out food that looks a bit too elderly, and obviously anything spoiled - those things go into the food scraps bin, but in general, food is to be eaten. This means excavating my freezer, having occasional ''leftovers nights'' where there are tubs of defrosted (complete portions) of prior meals and then a side of steamed veg or salad or whatever to accompany. You may think you're eating slow cooker lamb, but surprise! It's actually beef! The food has always been properly stored and thoroughly defrosted / stored in appropriate portions though, which is half the battle.
I have one of those flexible silicon wand things that scrapes out ALL of the mayo / ketchup or similar from the bottle. All. Of. It. I love that thing so much.
@Caro,
this is me to a T:
"I’m not a minimalist, I like my stuff, but too much with inadequate storage / places for said stuff makes me antsy."
@Maureen,
what is making me extra antsy is that we moved to a lovely house that we really like... but which has wildly inadequate storage, even for fairly minimalist people, never mind a family of 5! We will be remedying this in the new year, with properly planned and constructed closets and so on. Honestly, proper storage really helps.
@Caro, I try to remember to label food. I have taken enchilada sauce out of the freezer only to discover it is spaghetti sauce.
@Caro, Totally with you on the food thing. Sometimes my use-it-up skills outrun my energy levels.
I read an article that says someone donates their extra Christmas wrapping paper every year because they don't want to store it. My little frugal heart couldn't handle rebuying something every year.
@Julia, I didn't buy any new wrapping items this year. No tape, wrapping paper, bags or bows. I don't have to next year either. I actually found a trash bag in the back of a storage closet with spiderman wrap. I bought it 3 years ago before we moved.
@Amy cheapohmom, this wrapping paper does not fit in my organizer. It is 8 inches too long. Next time I will stick to the shorter rolls.
@Julia, I have an enormous roll of brown kraft paper on one of those cutter devices, which I bought for covering the backs of picture frames (for work). It has been my standard all-purpose gift wrap for over 30 years. Red ribbon for Christmas, white ribbon for wedding gifts, whatever other color for every other occasion, often with a little silk flower or pine cone (lodgepole cones are small) tied into the ribbon. I spend money on ribbon, usually buying a large roll that lasts forever. Plus, I reuse anything with life left that makes its way into my orbit. It suits my little heart which has an unquenchable need for a combination of simplicity, beauty, and frugalness. The thought of buying wrapping paper, much less storing it, almost makes my eye twitch.
@Julia, when we had a lot of people to buy for, we bought 2 huge rolls of wrapping paper for presents. It's got to be over 15 years now and we still have the wrapping paper and less people we buy for. And I always get name tags in the mail for some reason, so I haven't bought those in a while either.
As I've said in a few comments in previous years, I'm the product of a mixed marriage: My father was a neatnik/minimalist, and my mother was a packrat. So I feel I land in the middle of the spectrum, with a slight lean toward the more organized/minimal end. And I'm going to be leaning further in that direction in the coming year, as I continue to work on downsizing/decluttering my belongings.
@A. Marie, you are so lucky. booth my parents were packrats. and my hubby and 2 kids are packrats. but i love them so much.
@A. Marie, packrat or organized piles?
Even now that we have a house vs. an apartment, we deliberately bought small (<800 ft) to keep our possessions in check. I like to play the "If we were moving, would this make the cut?" game; if something isn't serving a direct purpose (and I consider beauty and sentiment a purpose, a la William Morris), why is it here? We are far from minimalists, nor are we maximalists. Empty rooms and walls, especially, disconcert me--walls are for art!--but I'm also a firm believer in giving things room to breathe so they can be appreciated/found/used. I'm a 2-3 sets of shoes person and only have one purse, but I carefully display year round the intricate beaded ornaments that a dear friend makes and sends every Christmas. The 12+ ornaments are gorgeous, catch the light in my studio, and make me happy.
@N, A friend makes the most wonderful christmas cards and they are the some of only ones that I keep and display every year.
@N, a resounding YES to William Morris and another YES to only one purse!! And thank you for giving me a new phrase to use: "walls are for art". 2-3 sets of shoes is a good goal, but if I had unlimited funds and space, I would want Crocs in every color that matched every outfit.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, When I ended up having to wear a full leg brace some years ago, I grieved most about giving away over 20 pair of Crocs. I used to rinse them off and then fill the dish washer with them once a year to clean them really well. I still have a picture of a washer filled with Crocs...
@Lindsey, that hurts. A dishwasher full! I don't have a dishwasher, so that is truly a funny thing to me. I learned the hard way to not leave them out in the sun—they shrink! Happy to know they survived the dishwasher.
What a lovely surprise to read this post this am. I like to know where everything is at all times. I had a very chaotic childhood & know that my desire for calm & quiet organization stems from that life experience. Drawer organizers are my secret to taming “junk drawers.” I have the cutest little batteries/birthday candle drawer & it’s all due to the inexpensive drawer organizer!! A re-purposed cardboard box wrapped in fun paper holds all my paper party supplies- you don’t have to buy anything, but I do think it’s about corralling like things together. Happy New Year!
@Diane, I have a 100+ work table I use for a desk. No organizers but I do have areas where certain things go. My DH thinks its funny that I can open the drawer and reset everything out of place. The drawer is 28 inches by 40 inches.
@Diane, to organize drawers I use the boxes from paper clips, binder clips, containers from Icelandic skyr, and so forth. When I get frustrated with them crumbling under pressure or want a small boost, I might buy a new containers that’s just right.
Hoarding is a form of OCD, isn’t it? Extreme minimalism probably is as well. I have a close friend who suffers from hoarding disorder and it really isn’t just being disorganized or liking a lot of stuff around. It’s a compulsion and seeing it is like seeing any other compulsive behavior, like seeing someone who washes his hands until they bleed yet cannot stop washing his hands.
My grandparents were also hoarders and my parents (who are neither hoarders nor minimalists) have inherited the whole hoarded mess.
I am not good at maintaining organized systems, so my solution to this is owning very little. Dana K White of A Slob Comes Clean talks about finding your clutter threshold. This is the amount of stuff you can keep under control. My SMIL has a very high clutter threshold. She has all of the things and they are all jenga’d into cabinets and she knows where everything is. Mine is very low.
Probably because of this, I get over-zealous about getting rid of stuff. Why do we own multiple spatulas? You can only use one at a time. My husband says this is so we have a spatula to use when one is dirty. I say wash the dirty one, otherwise you end up with two dirty spatulas.
My husband and kids have kept me from going too far because they all love stuff and see no problem with owning a whole lot of it. So we currently own three spatulas (2 for indoor use, 1 for grilling) and we regularly end up with 3 dirty spatulas. But I remind myself that I love them more than I hate clutter and I wash the spatulas and move on.
@Tarynkay, I kind of love your spatula philosophy. The extras either don't get used and contribute to clutter, or DO get used and contribute to dirty dishes. Three spatulas seem like plenty and you can apply that principal to a lot of things.
@Tarynkay, I had a lol moment reading your comment about your SMIL. “She has all of the things and they are all jenga’d into cabinets and she knows where everything is.”
I had a Finnish Airbnb guest once that was so fascinated by my kitchen drawers that she pulled me in to the kitchen and started opening them and showing me. “And look here!” Like I wasn’t the one who had jenga’d everything inside 😀
@Tarynkay, My MIL is a hoarder, and DH believes she has been for a long time. She gets sentimentally attached to objects, and also is a paper hoarder, out of anxiety that she needs to keep certain papers for information but doesn't have time to read it yet. (Like the years of church bulletins she's acquired.) Not sure if she has OCD, but she definitely has anxiety, and worries about items getting to people who can use them. The thought of throwing something away, or that it is no longer useful, gives her real anxiety.
I often go too far in decluttering, because I just love getting rid of stuff and cleaning out spaces. Once I was so zealous in cleaning out the car that I threw out not just the expired registrations, but the current one. Oops. That cost us. I've learned to be a bit more careful when it comes to paper!
@Tarynkay, I have a small spatula for eggs and a regular one for everything else. I once got a fish spatula and got rid of it within a year.
@Tarynkay, My thoughts are with your parents. I moved my aunt late in life and then helped clear my grandfather's, uncles and parents estate. My mother was not as much of a hoarder as the rest but still collected too much. It is so hard because you are looking for important things and have to wade through so much. My uncle had 4 bottle of mustard and was known to hide valuables in the freezer and fridge.
@Karen A., I'm afraid that your first paragraph describes my next-door neighbor all too well. She's been like this for a long time--at least since her husband died in 2004, to my knowledge--but it got a *lot* worse after her beloved only sister (who used to try to stem the tide on her visits here) died in a tragic accident in 2014. The hoarding is one of several reasons why NDN's other close friend and I are gravely concerned about her.
@Karen A., I threw away the keys to the front door. In my defense, we lived in a village and never locked our front door, so I did not recognize them. No one locked their vehicle doors there either, which saved my husband's life one time when he took out the garbage and a polar bear began running toward him and he was able to yank open the neighbor's truck door just in time. (They do not hibernate and blend right into the snow. We knew to check out the surroundings when we went out, but it was easy to miss him. The local radio announced every morning where the bears were last seen, but we hadn't heard the announcement.)
@Tarynkay, For myself, I don’t want to interrupt my cooking to wash a spatula so I have about 10: 1 huge one, 1 skinny one for jars and blenders, and 3-4 each of small and standard. [1] I don’t mind the extra dishes since the dishwasher does most of the work for me.
Good thing there’s room for many different preferences.
[1] Size descriptions totally subjective. There’s no such thing as standard spatula sizing.
@WilliamB, I am the same way with measuring cups & spoons. I do a fair amt of baking & like having several sets of measuring cups & spoons. It makes it so much easier to easily switch between dry & wet measurements.
@Lindsey,
WOW!! Be sure to include this story in your autobiography. 🙂
@Diane, and @ WilliamB,
I'm the same way. I have multiple sets of measuring cups (including one set of "odd" sizes, like 2/3 cup) and measuring spoons, as well as numerous spatulas. The measuring spoons I picked up at various yard sales. It really comes in handy, especially when baking.
My late husband and I were polar opposites in this regard and I did not notice it as a problem until very late in our marriage. With retirement and sale of our home looming, it was a heated topic and sadly, we never resolved it, leaving me with the burden of purging and organizing after his death. And I made headway, but still have much more to do. I'm not a minimalist, but I lean towards it and can see the value of not owning as much cargo in life. It has been personally liberating, allowing me to focus on what really matters and see past the clutter. I know exactly what I have and where it is. And my spaces stay clean and neat.
@Gina from The Cannary Family,
my condolences on your very sad loss. Honestly, I get very frustrated with the attitude of ''oh well, you can deal with it when I'm gone'' that my MiL has about her filthy, not-quite-hoarded, but not too far from hoarded home, and it will fall to her daughter, my SiL, someone she freely admits does so, so much for her mom and runs her life, essentially and isn't she wonderful, such an angel? Somehow the connection between wilfully ensuring her beloved daughter is left with a really big issue to solve at what will be a very sad, devastating time and that being completely within her gift to change is not made.
It's a tough one to be sure.
@Caro, My MIL has the same attitude about her hoarded, decrepit, moldy home. DH has been very frank about it: if she leaves him the house he will offer it to the local firefighters, so they can set it on fire and use it for practice. He's not kidding. He grew up in that hoarded, dirty house and hates it with a passion.
@Karen A., wow. That is extreme, and I find it admirable!
@Caro, so sad and unfair to your SIL. Maybe you could ease the awfulness of the pending chore by making a plan with your SIL? Having a strategy will help make it doable.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, When you grow up in a house where you have to kill a rat before you can get your morning cornflakes, it sticks with you.
@Karen A., my parents (one surviving) have lived in their home for 61+ years. I would not call it hoarding but a lot of "stuff". A lot of car related parts, a lot of family items. Nothing moldy, any over buying (I would not call it hoarding) was due to mom's Alzheimer's (OMG the number of throw rugs and table clothes were mind blowing). BUT sister and I culled through the items, donated good, pitched the rest (if not recyclable/re-usable as rags).
I am also somewhere in the middle but lean more towards hoarding. I struggle to get rid of things sometimes, although I'm better than I was. It's partly sentimental and partly because I don't want to add to a landfill. I did donate several boxes of books and videos a couple of years ago because I knew I was never going to read/watch them again and wanted someone else to enjoy them.
On a side note, I am also on the autism spectrum, so maybe some of that informs where I am on this spectrum as well! I know some autistic people have a hard time getting rid of things.
@Sophie in Denmark,
This describes me as well. When I was younger, I struggled to get rid of anything that I "might need one day". That changed as I got older, and I'd say most especially after helping my DH clean out his sister's home after she passed away unexpectedly, and then his parents home. It was all just a bunch of stuff. DH and I are not hoarders, but we still have boxes of things from his sisters house and my in law's house to sift through. (We have no excuses....my MIL has been gone for almost 5 years, and my SIL close to 10 years by now. Heh. )
@Liz B., Like @Tarynkay, I try not to buy a lot of things in the first place! I don't want to go to an extreme where I NEVER buy anything that isn't 'needed' though. I bought myself a beautiful ornament recently and it makes me so happy when I see it hanging on the wall (that William Morris quote comes to mind!)
@Sophie in Denmark,
That's so smart! I love that William Morris quote, and try to not buy anything new that is not useful or beautiful. I love beautiful ornaments! It must give you so much joy. Well done!
I'm probably right about where you are on that line, Kristen. I own far too many books to ever be a minimalist, but clutter drives me crazy. However, I live with five other people, none of whom are naturally minimalistic or tidy. This does get on my nerves, because I feel like I spend a lot of time dealing with everyone else's things. Yes, they should take care of their own things. But they usually don't. Since this really only bothers me, I feel like my choices are to nag incessantly, or just clean it up. I do require my children to clean their rooms (infrequently, despite their claims), but that usually necessitates my supervision for it to get done to any reasonable standard.
@kristin @ going country, I think dealing with stuff is part of being a mom. There are toys, books, games, sport equipment, clothing, school supplies and so forth. It seems to multiple exponentially with each child. Getting children to put things back where they belong is also challenging. When my chicks flew the nest, I was thrilled that I could finally find the scissors whenever I needed them.
@kristin @ going country, I've heard of moms who tell their kids that if they don't put their stuff away, it is going away permanently. Then they follow through with that threat. Read it somewhere, but don't know if it taught anything lasting to the messy children.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, My mom would get rid of my stuff without asking (including my three beloved baby blankets, and my brother's and my Star Wars action figures) and I can confirm that the only thing it taught us was our mom didn't care about what we loved or wanted to keep. So with my kids, I tried to be as patient as possible. Kids are often so busy playing and exploring that they don't see the need to "put things away" as they may come back to the toys later! So we focused on just picking up at the end of the day, and made it a safety issue: "Do you want anyone to trip on this in the dark and hurt themselves? No? Then let's put the toys to bed." Trust me, once a kid steps on a Lego in the dark he learns!
(FTR, the blankets in question were neatly folded on my closet shelf, and the action figures had been carefully tucked away and both my brother and I were planning to keep them forever!)
@kristin @ going country,
Oh my, 100% yes to “too many books to be considered a minimalist” but also share a house with people who aren’t as concerned with clutter as I am.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, For some kids, taking away their stuff does have a permanent effect. Others, not so much. I don’t know enough about kids in general to know how to predict which is which.
@WilliamB,
One of your superpowers? 🙂
@Karen A., sorry that your mother did not show up with a pick-up truck of your "stuff" once you bought a house. Mine did lol.. But both were children of the Depression era kids (born right before WWII started).
Oh, I have many thoughts. I first became a semi-minimalist when I was in high school and college. As a child I had the smallest bedroom in the house, and I learned if it was cluttered I felt trapped, so I started becoming what my friends called a "neat freak". Really, it was a reaction to my environment. When I went off to college, my first dorm had all very small rooms (originally nun's rooms!) and I was perfectly comfortable fitting in there. (I say semi-minimalist because I was raised by a compulsive shopper, and I learned to deal with negative feelings by shopping. My mom liked to buy clothes, I chose to buy books, music, DVDs or things that were consumable.) It's worth noting that my friends liked to come to my dorm room to relax, because they said it was so peaceful!
When I got married, we went through a phase of buying homes, often large ones, and I never liked them. Too much to clean, too many rooms to lose things in or to fill up, unconsciously, with stuff. Of course, when all four boys were young, they needed space to run around and play, so it made some sort of sense. Now they're older, and we fit nicely in what some would consider too small of a house.
For me, the main advantage of a small house is: it automatically reduces my purchases. We sometimes consider a purchase and then realize we have no room for it! (Or I spot some furniture out by the curb, and DH reminds me that free furniture is no good with no room for it, ha.) In a large house, the principle of Nature abhorring a vacuum comes to mind. Empty spaces will get filled. I used to dream of the days when the Lego pieces would stop taking over all the nooks and crannies of our house, and lo! those days came. It was a great day when we took the boxes of Lego to the dump (where they promptly got picked up by other people dumping other stuff!)
I guess my main philosophy of stuff boils down to a quote I read many years ago (maybe even in the Tightwad Gazette!): "Have nothing in your house that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful." If I don't use it regularly, or it doesn't add visual pleasure (like my framed Star Trek 25th anniversary poster :D) it doesn't stay.
DH often calls me a Luddite because I resist new technology. But I have adapted; I have a Kindle and use it for Kindle Unlimited books (less clutter, and nice for travel). I use a cell phone, though I want to stop compulsively looking things up on it (bad example for the kids). I don't have a smart watch or fitness tracker, though I did once upon a time until it broke.
@Karen A., Although repeated by many, that quote is attributed to the great British designer, William Morris. He was a significant figure in the Arts and Craft Movement, a socialist, and prolific writer. It is great advice!
Well you've added a new word to my vocabulary...discusser!!! Thank you!
I am loving stuff and do hoard some. Lots of books and lots of jigsaw puzzels. I like looking at them and having choices, when i want to read or puzzle.
However I do know what I have and also enough space to store my stuff.
First a quick observation- as I read the topic intro, I had pictured the spectrum running from minimalist on the left to hoarder on the right (like a horizontal number line going from zero to infinity). So I was surprised when it was drawn the other way, which made me think about how there are so many ways to visualize data differently (a previous topic of discussion here, which was really interesting!). On a related note, I personally picture the pending New Year calendar re-set as a "typewriter carriage return", so December 31 and January 1 are mentally far apart for me.
Anyway, I am most content in the minimalist camp. However, life is busy/full with a family, so inevitably stuff and piles accrue. We try to beat back the clutter and give stuff away regularly. Most things have a place, though, so the house is generally organized with localized chaos. My tendencies toward both frugality and minimalism sometimes compete, in that I'd rather store an item that might be needed later, instead of having to acquire it again.
@PD,
that's such a good point, where minimalism sometimes is at odds with frugality, and of course the key is to A/ have proper, suitable storage that is organised well and B/ to recognise what is likely to be wanted again / when / what is not actually going to be used within the next few years and treat accordingly.
This is true. Sometimes the most extreme minimalist influencers are people who have a lot of wealth, which is interesting.
I guess if you have enough money to buy anything you want at any time, you don't need to do things like keep extras around or pick up freebies or buy in bulk.
I do love Kristen's Very Good Art, btw! 🙂
I have multiple loved ones who lean toward hoarding. Not to the level of the tv shows and all with an amount of depression and anxiety involved. My aunt would see a craft project and collect the items needed to do it x 30. Plus she was a farmer's wife and would keep a lot of parts and pieces so that if something broke they might be able to fix it. But then kept it forever.
With that being said I am in the middle, I have tried to reduce my consumption and I am always going through my stuff and getting rid of it. Christmas is the worst because I have inherited decorations from many people and find it difficult to cut them back. Which means I don't buy anything new except lights. It is an ongoing process.
It's so easy to get too much stuff, especially when one is married to an accumulator. Although this physical item is actually a device that stores energy and releases it when necessary, the word is also a pretty accurate descriptor for my skiing/outdoor/meditating/scientist husband. As a result, I'm always on the lookout for things that could go on their merry way (looking at you old paper shredder--your time here is very limited). I'm definitely on the lesser side of average with my things, but keep plenty for whenever grown kids stop home, or we have friends over. But I don't buy new things just to have them or because some advertisement proclaimed them essential. Now if I could just get my husband to stop buying unnecessary stuff.
What a fun topic! I’m looking forward to reading all the comments, hopefully I can get some tips because I’m definitely on the far left side on your Very Good Art piece.
As I’ve written in my meet a reader answers (which I’m still editing two years later because I’m a maximalist in every way so it can be a series of three posts) I’m working on the compulsion of not needing to have all the things. I feel safer/better with a full pantry, freezer and extras of everything.
Like Ruth T, part of my problem is finding the time to find new homes for the things I’m decluttering. I find it difficult to just send it all to the thrift shop. In part because I don’t know if the things will actually get a new owner there and partly because of the money aspect as I know that I could have sold it.
And finally, what I could have written as one of my superpowers is the ability to find an (alternative) use for practically everything. I have a big bag of clothes that need mending or alternating, a pile of furnitures that I have plans for and so on and so on.
And there is just so many things that I need to save. Save from the landfill, save from other people that may not appreciate them as much as I (I know!)
And when I have the room to storage all of these things it’s not a problem at all because I’m great at organizing and love a full to do-list but now there is so much that there is stuff e v e r y w h e r e.
For several years I’ve followed a challenge from a Norwegian financial blogger, #sell100. In 2025 I will in addition have a no-buy challenge (with some exceptions like underwear etc. Plus I have a budget of $50 secondhand shopping to have some joy 😉 ) and get rid of one thing a day. We’ll see if I’m still this overwhelmed at the end of 2025 😀
I had to study your diagram for a minute because I couldn’t understand it. Then I realized why: my head has minimalism on the left and hoarding on the right. Or perhaps more accurately they’re both on the right of my brain but on a vertical scale with minimalism at the bottom and hoarding at the top.
Neither here nor there, but it made me chuckle.
I’m in the middle. I prefer fewer things, but I have a medically complex child who comes with accessories on top of the normal accessories of childhood. And I live in a cold place so we have oodles of hats and mittens/gloves (most without matches at this point), and I’m still clearing out clutter from downsizing.
@Kaitlin,
So many mittens and gloves!. My kids rarely have matching gloves anymore. But I'm not about to fit rid of singletons; they'll keep their hands warm just the same.
Hahaha, I love how you brain thought of the spectrum differently than me in a visual sense.
@Kaitlin, when teen was younger I started buying all the gloves in the same color & brand that way when one was lost we could still use without mismatching. Of course, now it's just bigger same color & brand, but not as many. 😉
@mbmom11, I sewed mittens and gloves on a long ribbon and make them go from one sleeve to the other. No way to loose a glove without losing the entire jacket .
I definitely am more minimalist than hoarder, probably in part because I didn't have a lot growing up. (Yes, I have just one spatula.)
One of my oldest friends died last year and to everyone's shock she was an extreme hoarder. She always had a logical reason for not getting together at her place and none of us had any idea what was going on. It was painful to learn about the conditions she was living in and I hate that she felt she had to hide this from everyone.
I am not a minimalist nor am I a hoarder. I can make that statement with certainty. Although I try to have a specific place for everything, I do have hotspots in my house that become disorganized. For example, my pantry currently needs some attention.
I think maintaining a healthy relationship with stuff can be difficult for those of us that are frugal. When I was younger and poorer, I was reluctant to get rid of things that I might need someday. Interestingly, I went through a period of time after reading The Tightwad Gazette when I kept many useless things. I actually thought that I would find I use for things toilet paper tubes. Thankfully that was short lived.
I do keep things that many people throw away like gift bags. These are neatly fold and placed in a storage container until next Christmas. I always save rubber bands and twisty ties. On the other hand, I clean out unneeded items periodically. I donate them or give them away on Buy Nothing.
I do not keep a minimalist home. I have a few collections of things that I love that are integrated into my life and/or decor. I will never have unadorned white walls, and I will always have books and china.
Although it could be done at this time of my life, I also can’t quite embrace the capsule wardrobe. I have been flirting with this idea for sometime. I used to work in a professional position outside the home. I really dressed ever.single.day. I also had a collection of evening clothes. I have been slow to let go of these things. I suppose that I must come to terms with the concept that aspects of my life have permanently changed.
Like many of you, however, I have had the experience of cleaning out the home of a loved one. I don’t want to leave a mess for my children. My in-laws’ home took nearly 10 months to clear. It was only 1600 square feet, but it was stuffed. There was just so much garbage. Only 20% of the items had value. It was grueling task for DH and me especially when my SIL came from New Mexico to help. She is a true hoarder and does like to throw away garbage. She was taking things out of the trash. Eventually she took nearly everything -even the stained bed pillows —and placed it in storage here in Florida. After all, she could move back here some day. That was 10 years ago.
@Bee, that is utterly horrifying about your SIL from NM. Revolting. So sorry you endured 10 months of not only the grueling task, but also the battle.
@Bee, I know exactly what you mean about realizing/ accepting that one is in a new chapter of life where things/clothing are no longer relevant. That’s a hard mental journey to acknowledge the past is past. Getting rid of professional or formal clothing, books you aren’t really going to read again (and probably can find at a library), single purpose kitchen gadgets, shoes that aren’t comfortable but still in good shape, excess office supplies, etc.
I too have helped clean out 3 homes and have friends whose patents left them a mess to sort through and trash. I lean toward minimalism as a result. Leaving your heirs with a mess is so unkind.
I volunteer at an upscale thrift shop so I get a lot of opportunities to “refresh” my belongings for what suits my season of life and what gives me fresh joy. However, I almost always bring a bag of donations to my work shift to compensate.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, Although it was frustrating, I felt sorry for my SIL. It made her anxious to part with anything even an old jar. She could not differentiate between garbage and things of value. I guess this is one of the characteristics of a hoarder. It really is a handicap.
Yes! Imagine how awful it must be to live that way. It would be very frustrating.
This is a frustrating topic for me. “Stuff” makes me anxious and I love to organize and have everything put away out of sight. However, my small house doesn’t have enough storage space in the right areas to keep things organized and put away the way I’d like. Add to that that I live with three other people who don’t feel the same way. I think I’d probably fall somewhere in the middle of the spectrum because I settle for somewhat messy for practicality sake.
I wouldn't consider myself a minimalist, but holidays and kids' birthdays where I know "things" will be coming into my house tend to stress me out. I try to combat this by doing a spring and fall "cleaning" in my house where I empty every drawer, cabinet, and closet, clean it out, and then wipe walls, shelves, vacuum behind furniture, etc. My only rule is that less has to go back in than what I pulled out. During this time, I keep a list of things that we are running low on so I can be on the lookout for sales. I also have a list of things my kids will need, and it's handy they have fall/winter bdays because those things like socks, pj's, etc. make excellent gift ideas for their grandmas!
I have a policy with my kids where anything they are "done" with they can put in the laundry room, and I will donate it or pass it down to a cousin, or try to sell it for them for extra college account $.
As far as where things "go", I have to work with my brain, and I think it was Dana from A Slob Comes Clean that gave me a eureka moment when she said her rule for where to put things starts with "where would I look for this first?"
Also, I don't wait for the spring/fall cleaning times to declutter, if we get something new, I try to always get rid of something else to make room.
Food is a hard one for me to be "minimalist", as there are 4 of us in the house and the kids pack lunches for school every day, so I try to shop on sale and stock up on the things we will use, but try to always rotate the older items to the front and make a mental note of what needs to be used up!
@Jen, my kids & (now Ex) husband used to tease me about our pantry & refrigerator looked like the grocery store. When I shopped (always sale items) I would rotate/put new items in back to ensure FIFO (first in first out) to help deter spoilage.
@Regina, I store thing to promote FIFO as well. I also put the clean clothes on the bottom of the pile so make rotating easy as well.
This is an interesting topic for me personally. In my home I feel that I fall right in the middle of the spectrum. I want my home to feel cozy and lived in but be clutter free at the same time. I despise Chotskies (sp?), figurines, and other items that make surfaces look cluttered to me. I believe that this is due to growing up in homes where people admired porcelain figurines, doilies on everything that sat still and faux flowers draped over everything. If that is your style hooray for you but I have to pass.
I don't tend to lose things as I am mostly methodical when it comes to commonly lost items like keys or my work badge - they go in the same place every time.
I am in an almost constant state of purging and I do giant clean outs 4-5 times per year. I am constantly reorganizing my pantry and other closets. I have a growing young boy so we purge his closet and toys at least twice a year. The garage and whole house is purged twice per year and I donate or give away items that are not being used or are rarely used and just taking up space. I admit that organization is something that I am still working on after having a company pack us out of our house and then move us back in after our home flooded in Jan 2024 but this is high on my list of priorities for January.
I have had first hand experience with hoarding and it is something that you simply cannot unsee or ever forget. When my Father died in May of 2018, I was left to handle his affairs as his only child. I too watched the Hoarders show before this ever happened and when I tell you that the show in no way glammed it up for TV, please trust me. There was not only piles and piles and piles of things, but trash, bugs, old food items - think going to Costco and buying a case of spaghetti sauce and never using it, it was in a single word - filthy. I know that this is a mental illness and combined with an elderly person who refused help, the situation had no where to go but down hill. I can say with confidence that this is the reason I am so aware of getting rid of what is no longer useful and keeping the space we call home as organized as it can possibly be.
@Angie, two things: "tchotchkes" and I think you are an organizational declutterer extraordinaire!
That's a word I'd have had to type out, inspect, think, "does that look right??" and swap a few letters before landing on the correct spelling. Heh.
@Angie, had a distant relative (serious hoarder, also a millionaire) who also bought cases of spaghetti sauce at Sam's and stored it in the oven (which he rarely used) except for the day he did and forgot about the spaghetti sauce being in there!
This is one of my favorite topics. I've been on my minimalist journey since 2010 or slightly before. It came after a relapse(cancer) and I felt overwhelmed by everything around me. I started getting rid of tons of things and many were mid century collections that was/is my passion. I must have done a 100 Goodwill/ Salvation army runs. Our house is quite small and old with a terrible layout, but once I started removing the excess, it opened up.
I dont lose things, and know where almost everything is. I don't hide things in draweres or closets mostly because this house only has 1 closet.
I learned a lot from Fly lady during that time about getting rid of excess so you can mangae what you have. The same with Dana K White. Her container concept is perfect. You can only fit what the container is makes alot of sense. Plus she was a true hoarder who overcame it.
I still am not a extreme minimalist but a minimalist with just enough.
I have had more than a few people enter my home and promptly ask if I am a professional home stager. I am always deeply flattered when that occurs, lol.
I love home design, and I spend a significant amount of mental energy scanning and assessing my home for anything that needs addressing, on an almost daily basis. I've been asked to help others with their home design, but I always hesitate because what works for me, space and design wise, would not necessarily work for someone else.
I am not a minimalist, but I am extremely uncomfortable when things are out of place, so I am sure I have some OCD tendencies mixed in there as well.
The one place I can get a little carried away is with my clothes. My husband and I have an active social life, and I love dressing up a bit each time we go out. HOWEVER (LOL!), I have a large and very well organized closet, and I stay well within budget by shopping places like H&M, Broadway Shoes, etc. Plus I purge constantly- there is almost always something waiting to go to the Salvation Army store in the area in our garage we've set aside for that purpose.
I continually and constantly purge. The feeling of letting go of stuff that no longer serves is a something I really appreciate. Marie Kondo, as you might guess, is one of my idols. 🙂
I am extremely organized but not necessarily "minimalist" although I am most definitely not a sentimental saver either. My biggest issue with this whole topic is the fact that people assumed (when my children were younger) that because our home was always neat and clean/organized that I must be neglecting my children because I spent all my time cleaning and organizing. That was/is FAR from the case and, frankly, I always found those comments to be rude. How would that same person feel if I said "Your children are living in a messy/unorganized home so you must not love them and be neglectful."? Do what works for you! My clean and organized actually allowed me plenty of time with my children! I wasn't spending all my time cleaning up or looking for things that got lost in the mess! Everything in our home had a "home" and my kids knew where to find anything. (Yes, it took much training to get them to clean up before getting out something else, but they did it!) Our children are all grown now. Each of them, at different times in adulthood, has thanked me for keeping a clean and organized home. That doesn't mean my home is any better (or worse!) than yours. It just means that's what worked for our family!
@Julia, Oh, my MIL would say things like that--if she came over and some toys happened to be out on the floor, she would say something to the effect of how it made her "glad to see a little mess" because it meant the mother was playing with the children instead of cleaning "all the time." Very passive-aggressive. Grr.
@Karen A., Count your blessings; my mother was the opposite. If she called and I was at the town pool with the kids, she’d ask me how I can get my housework done, playing with the kids.
Just aggressive, she skipped the passive part ha!
Ooo, good topic Diane!
I am more inclined to keep stuff, especially sentimental things, but it must be organized and I can't have too many things or I get anxious. Piles of clutter drive me insane, so they do not build up. I will go through my closets now and then and clear stuff out, I have organizers in the drawers that are filled with small things like socks, office supplies and underwear, and I try to get rid of clothes I no longer wear or things I no longer use at least once or twice a year. I had a junk drawer but I got rid of it one heroic day.
My father kept anything he considered useful. He also had a shed full of tools with a U-shaped path through the shed and more tools hanging overhead, but he knew exactly where each tool was located and what tools he had. My mother kept a very neat house, but she did things like stack books behind the couch where they were unseen and filled our old bedroom closets, bathroom cabinets and dressers with stuff. All three beds had boxes of stuff under them. Their house was stuffed to the gills, but invisibly. Growing up, we didn't have room or money to gather much stuff, so my childhood house was neither cluttered nor stuffed.
I had a co-worker who had a small barn on his property where he kept cast-off furnishings, old books, lamps, kitchen items, etc., because his son might need them when he went off to college, only his son didn't. So then he kept them in case any family, friends or co-workers needed them. They didn't. He was one of those who airily said it would be his son's problem to empty that barn once my co-worker and his wife were gone. I said that wasn't too kind to his son, and he should clean it out himself, because what if he and his wife decided to move. After going through all the stuff in my parents' house left after the fire, plus that tool shed and a small shed, all stuffed full, I felt for his son. My co-worker would just chuckle and brush it off as his son's problem, until one day he had a sudden job change and had to move for his new job, so HE had to empty all that stuff out of the barn and haul it off in a short period of time. Five U-Haul loads, which he had to load and unload. Well, I had warned him.
I am three quarters of the way toward the minimalist end of the spectrum. My version of a junk drawer is one where the different sizes of paper clips are mixed together.
Kristen, I think your question “Is this working for you?” is key to knowing and accepting oneself.
I definitely hoard some things but not all things. I sell at craft shows and on Etsy so I hoard craft supplies. I probably have too many clothes but everything fits in one closet. I keep too many things because of sentimental attachment. I have very unpleasant memories of the 1 1/2 yrs I spent emptying my parents' house so I am trying to do better for my kids' sake.
My family has a strong neurodivergence gene (adhd, autism) on both my side and my husband's, and I have come to learn that so many issues such as organization, hoarding etc, can be traced to this.
For instance, I have known people who are very minimalist and organized in an attempt to control their ADHD, or vice versa.
One's life situation and resources also makes a huge impact. My mother experienced many losses as a young person and later lack of financial resources, and she has used "hoarding" as a way to create a physical safety barrier. This hasn't always worked well because she has adhd and is very disorganized although she cleans a lot. My father who had autism was very organized and in this way my parents were very compatible, but he also threw away my favorite toys while they were still new or I was playing with them. (We also did not have much money or toys, so this was very distressing to me.)
I moved to another country from where I grew up, and I definitely like to collect things from my home country as another form of safety net, although I'm much more organized than my mother.
On the other hand, I have kids with adhd who are extremely chaotic and disorganized, and this has been very taxing in our house. Sometimes it's best to choose your battles and leave the chaos in order to have a better home atmosphere, although we do constantly tidy things up and declutter.
So really, "stuff" in our lives are always live in an ebb and flow and represent so much more than somebody on the outside can easily understand.
If I lived alone, I would definitely fall into the "minimalist" category. And I would live in a small space. I don't like having a lot of stuff around me, I breath better when the surroundings are clean and sparse. But I live with 3 other people, so.....
I try to keep my personal belongings to what I actually need and use, but I gave up on trying to get my family to purge, as it was sometimes creating conflicts, and I have been told a couple times that I was "obsessive" when it comes to purging stuff.
One day - when the kids are no longer living at home - it is in the plans to buy a much smaller house and I will then stand my ground with hubby about what comes in (to a certain extent, still being respectful of his own wants and needs)
If 0 was a horder assigned number, and 100 is an extreme minimalist, I’m about an 80.
It’s a good balance for me. I lean towards minimalism because it makes me less stressed, happier, and “doing life” is easier for me (cleaning and laundry aren’t as overwhelming)
I enjoy using most of the things I own. I do keep some sentimental items which do not need a purpose
Everything in its place is HUGE for me. I feel like I can handle just about anything in life if my keys and wallet and shoes (etc.) are where they need to be. With two youngish kids in the house I feel like messes happen every day and I can feel overwhelmed by the clutter, but it is such a relief that we can clean up very quickly because - say it with me now - everything has a place.
I'm definitely middle of the line. I used to tend more toward hoarding, then minimalism, and now I'm somewhere in between and quite content to be where I've landed.
The way I understand hoarding is that it is actually a mental illness. You can have a lot of clutter and not be a hoarder.
I personally am not a minimalist in the strictest sense of the word, but I do have minimalist tendencies. Some of that is in relation to finances and what I can afford. If I had more expendable money, for example, I would have more clothes.
I am definitely not a minimalist when it comes to houseplants. 😉
Yes, that is a good point; maybe I should have changed the spectrum to run from minimalism to clutter-heavy.
@Kristen, I think the latest buzzword is "Maximalist". At least as it pertains to home decoration.
@Kristen, ‘Tisn’t necessarily clutter. “Clutter” is like “weed” - if you don’t like it, it’s clutter (or a weed); if you do, it’s your stuff (or your lawn).
@WilliamB, I've heard it this way: Stuff is the junk you keep; junk is the stuff you get rid of.
@Central Calif. Artist Jana, I love that.
I forgot to say before that I got rid of a lot of stuff when I did an international move. Sometimes it's helpful for me to imagine moving again when I do a clear-out. I also have a small place so don't have room for lots of things!
I think that true hoarding is a different matter entirely and the spectrum I would use would probably have "Packrat" on one end and "Minimalist" on the other.
I can be a packrat and hold onto things "I might need it one day". This leads to hanging onto spare cords, multiple tools of the same kind, too many empty boxes or bubble envelopes from things that arrived in the mail, etc. I have definitely gotten better and have cleared out cord clutter, books, etc. I've also had to work on getting past not wanting to part with something because of the money spent on it. I still struggle with this depending on the specific item at hand. I declutter regularly, take items in for consignment, sell items online, and donate items.
Over the years, I've become much more intentional with what I buy as the amount of money spent on all that "stuff" that ended up being donated or sold for pennies on the dollar was difficult to swallow and that is one of the major reasons why people hold onto "stuff".
My biggest issue with the amount of "stuff" that I own is not being able to find something due to not implementing - and using! - an organization system. I've just recently downsized and got rid of a significant amount of "stuff" and am trying to implement an organized home. Renovations have prevented me from unpacking a lot of items and at least once per day I struggle to find something that I need that is still packed somewhere in the large stack of boxes. I know that this situation is temporary and renos will be finished soon. As I unpack I will again assess every item coming out of the boxes and I have no doubt that even more items will go for consignment/donation.
Oh, I like that for the ends of the spectrum....packrat is a good, compact way of saying it!
Although I suppose some extreme packrats have undiagnosed OCD, and are actually hoarding.
The main point to remember is that when someone has a seriously extreme way of dealing with stuff (and this might include extreme minimalism), there could be an underlying mental illness, and such a person deserves compassion and help, not judgment.
My life has had several natural purge stages. I married late in life and had a son at 40. When Hubby and I combined houses we let go of tons of things. 5 years ago we became empty nesters and, again, I released 20 years of childhood things plus inherited items. I looked thoughtfully at the six 8 x 8 bake pans and asked - How many do I really need? Any shelf that clattered when I took something out was emptied and sorted ruthlessly. Chipped, broken, a singleton of a pair, outdated, et all were ruthlessly donated or toss. I curated my wardrobe over 2 years so now there are only things I love and wear.
I have just retired at 60. I feel I am in my 4th Quarter. Ironically we will be moving from a 2,000 square foot house to a 5,000 square foot, 1912 renovation. My pledge is to NOT just fill it with THINGS that eventually my son will have to deal. I will not buy new unless it is absolutely necessary. Thankfully, antique furniture from this era are in abundance - free or cheap if I absolutely need something for functionality.
Before I make my carefully-thought-out comment I want to say that a junk drawer is not necessarily disorganized! If you know what’s in it, then it is organized, even if not every. single. item. inside is spiffy-looking.
I do not always know what is in mine, so not only is it lacking in visual appeal, it is also disorganized. Ha.
Yes, yes, but what did you spend? What did you eat??? I'm starting to twitch over here...
Hubby and I are intentionally paring down our items to three large suitcases. In 2026 we will sell our house and live exclusively in Airbnbs while we travel the Caribbean. For us, getting rid of things is a step toward a goal that is important to us.
@Steph D., this is amazing! Would love to hear more about this between now and 2026!
@Steph D., if you visit Curacao, write to me. I will give you an island tour .
@Steph D., that is so great. you should start a blog. i am fascinated by your plans. good luck.
About a year and a half ago I started watching minimalist youtube channels. It really resonnated with me as I've moved countless times in my life and having less stuff makes that so much easier. I'm continually looking over what I have and trying to evaluate if anything needs to go. I enjoy declutter and find keeping my house tidy is easier for me when I own less.
I am in my eighties and have accumulated a lot over the years and fantasize about a huge clear out which doesn't seem to happen. Would like to do some though but it is hard to stay with it. I do admire your more simple life which seems helpful on so many levels.
@S.T., I'm sure a friend could help you with this monumental task. Do you live anywhere near the central Eastern Seaboard?
I'm to the left of Elaine. Way to the left I have piles of papers on my desk, piles of books around my bed, piles of laundry in the laundry room and piles of whatever on the kitchen counters.
My New Year's resolution is to edit the piles and reduce the clutter by at least half.
I have a head start on that project: I gathered up all my DIY books that haven't been touched in ages -- these days, I just hire a handyman -- and gave those books to Habitat Re-Store. Figured people shopping for building supplies are DIYers and may appreciate them. And Habitat is a good cause.
Speaking of which, I would like to propose that in memory of Jimmy Carter, who died yesterday, we all donate what we can to our local Habitat for Humanity chapters. Habitat for Humanity builds decent, affordable housing for people who buy them at cost (ie, no interest on the mortgage and the labor is done by volunteers, so there is no charge for that, either.). And, as you know, affordable housing is becoming more and more uncommon. Anyway, when Betty White died, lots of people gave to animal rescues in her memory, so I think it'd be nice to do the same if President Carter is/was one of your heroes. Even though he was a former president, he was humble enough to put on work clothes and go do common carpentry on a Habitat build, and it did it on a fairly regular basis. He was a big Habitat supporter for many years! Even if you don't have much to give, every dollar counts. And if you can't give money, perhaps donate items to one of their Re-Stores, which is a thrift store specializing in building materials, or a regular thrift store supporting Habitat (there used to be one in Orange City, Fla., when I lived there -- I still have the crockpot I bought from them!). Does anyone have too many tools or lumber or paint supplies or old ceiling fan parts? And they're always in need of volunteers -- you could volunteer an hour in Jimmy and Rosalyn Carter's memories. Anyway, just a thought.
@Fru-gal Lisa, I love this and it will help me move on some painting items that need to be used by someone who needs them.
@Fru-gal Lisa, I have piles too so perhaps we are walking closer than you think. Perhaps I am mourning a more innocent time that is past, but the death of former President Carter makes me profoundly sad.
I am in the middle. I live on a farm, have a fully equipped shop that I have upgraded tools via garage sales/estate sales/hand me downs. I have rentals that I maintain, so I pick up extra light fixtures, plumbing parts, etc when they are listed on the Buy Nothing group. I do not keep more than 2 of any fixture. They are placed in a tub/labeled and handy. I have my tractor tools in one area, I sold my cat & excavator to a friend for a great price and he is now my "big machine guy". I keep a small set of tools on my 4 x 4 atv.
I do have a junk drawer in the kitchen. Holds pliers, screwdrivers, batteries, rubber bands. I seem to have a catch all at my desk...it needs a little love & understanding.
My clothes are quickly becoming minimalist.
My kitchen is quite minimalist, sold my china, sold my silver, crystal - gave it away.
I have 5 sets of scrubs (one set is always in my locker at work as are my newest shoes...stuff happens). I work usually 1 - 2 days per week, this past week and this week I work 4 days straight, out of town (2 hrs one way).
My pantry is fully stocked and organized, as are my freezers (one chest freezer with fruit and veggies, flours and nuts, one freezer with fish & bait, one big chest freezer with Beef, pork, stewing chickens, moose, elk, deer and ducks & the occasional turkey).
It took me years to figure out how much canning and presserving I needed. When I lost 1/2 my family in one horrible year, I needed 2 years to eat up the pantry. Now I know exactly how much I need to grow.
@Blue Gate Farmgirl, A lot does depend on where you live. When we lived in the bush Alaska, we never threw anything away because (and this was prior to Amazon) many places either won't ship to Alaska or charge exorbitant rates, so you kept things "just in case" you would need them in the future. People who came to the village for the first time would ALWAYS comment on how messy the yards were with old stuff, but because of permafrost, our houses were all on stilts and were small so the yard was about it for places to leave stuff. There were no basements or attics, no storage sheds because of the cost, all you had was the yard. I still keep too much stuff, but not nearly what we did in the bush.
@Blue Gate Farmgirl, I am with you on the food and farming equipments. Tools that you use are not junk in anyway . I like sharing heavy equipment, like a mulcher and stuff like that . I like common usages of goods, it still feels silly to me that every home has a washing machine ( my grandmother had one used by 5 families). I keep a deep pantry of over a year for men and beast.
What fun to read so many great comments. I am honored and frankly a bit surprised to be the center of not just one, but two of works of Very Good Art! Kristen, you have identified my spot on the spectrum very accurately - it's nice to be walking near you along the middle of the road. I grew up hearing "everything has it's place" ad nauseum and have totally gotten out of the habit, hence having to ask my husband to call my phone so I can find it. So, my New Year's resolution for 2025 is to identify just one place for all my everythings so it is a less stressful year.
I am a maximalist for sure! I have my one junk room (my office) where I keep most of my "stuff " (clutter to some people). I have a small house, so it is what it is. I do try to tidy that room on occasion, but it can be overwhelming.
My heart is probably at the 70% minimalist on the scale, but my reality is much farther to the left. I'm working on it. I have a lot knitting and quilting supplies that don't have a home in my small house, so there are boxes and bags and tubs to deal with. I have ADD which also leaves me overwhelmed at times with breaking down tasks in a way that I can actually make progress. But that's what I'm working on this week since I have time off work. This post was very timely and encouraging.
I have often wondered about people who shop a lot. Like every single week (not groceries).
BUT since they shop in thrift stores they don’t think it counts as accumulating things. Where do we stand on heading to the stores, thrift shops specifically multiple times a week? I can’t figure out where they store the stuff. But I do understand that frequent shoppers get something out of it, like a happiness boost, from heading into stores.
Is this a relative to hoarding? Where does this fall on the spectrum?
@ErikaJS, I too wonder how constant accumulation of secondhand things counts as frugal or necessary. That said, I drop off at least one bag of items twice a month to my favorite charity shop and because I am there, take a stroll through the store and inevitably find things to take home. A good day is when I drop off a larger volume than I bring home. This habit helped me over the past Christmas to give very nice gifts to family, things that cost very little. It gets intoxicating so I should probably do a cleanse...
Ok, after reading through comments & replying to a few comments I have to say that I see that most people (including myself) fall in the middle somewhere.
For me my biggest problem is that I'm still adjusting from bigger family size to only 2 people. Yes we downsized our house, which I'm still adjusting to & finding proper storage places for what I already had beforehand. Sorting & deciding what definitely need. Of course, I'm also trying to rewire my years of "____ would like this for (birthday/holiday gift)" because I don't need to anymore. And only buy extra sale items enough for no more than one row on shelf to be used.
Plus I want to start getting closer to the less items side.
I used to love the idea of maximalism, because I really only saw it on Pinterest. And I am a person who likes creature comforts; I'm a bit of a homebody by nature, and so living in a cozy, comfortably mis-matched and cluttered hobbit-hole seemed ideal...
But now, after several years of living in a small space, I've learned my lesson. The line between "maximalism" and "cluttered mess" is thin! If you have a lot of stuff, you have to keep your home pretty clean and tidy in order for it look nice. If you have less stuff, it's easier to keep clean and easier to tidy up. Having lots of open display is great if you have beautiful things, but if not, it's just more clutter!
Now, I'm often trying to buy less and get rid of things. I don't want to be a minimalist, exactly, but I no longer enjoy having extras of things. We have enough dishes and cutlery to set eight place settings. It's enough for us to have two meals as a family without running the dishwasher, and we rarely have more than five guests at a time. I do NOT want more dishes, and my fingers are itching to get rid of our extra glasses and mugs and the cutlery leftover from our pre-marriage sets...
I have made several attempts at writing this and this one may go the way of those others. Throughout the YEARS of comments on this organized-minimalist-hoarder phenomenom it usually places those without a currently popular philosophy about the issue into the wrong side of the issue.
@BRENDA, popular philosophies (and right and wrong) come and go, don't they... It's fun that now I'm old enough to see old philosophies resurrected under new names and now with cool influencers who think they are really smart and have discovered something brand new.
It’s amazing how differently people feel about ‘stuff’ and even how one person’s perspective can change! I have had minimalist homes, now have what most would call a maximalist home and everything in between over the years. Even when I look around and see so many belongings, I am firmly in the camp that everything must have a purpose - either beauty or frequent use.
I believe that for many who struggle with staying organized the issue is less about the amount of items they own than the systems they have in place. That doesn’t simply mean “everything in its place”. It took me 30+ years to learn how differently people’s minds work. The system that works beautifully for one does not necessarily work for another. Saying “I keep very few things but I still can’t find what I need” tells me you are spending too much time looking at other people’s solutions and not considering how your own brain works. Look at areas of life where you excel, are there habits that could translate to organization? Maybe the question “where will I need this?” works for some. But that may not be how your brain processes. You may need to put a green ring on your keys so when it’s in the green bowl by the dresser it makes sense to you. If papers are about a myriad of different issues but are all white and you gravitate to thinking about items based on their color, how can you organize them so it fits with your brain pattern?
And always leave a little extra space when you organize an area! If you empty a drawer and organize everything so it all fits snuggly, you are immediately disorganized when you later find that one thing in another room that should go in that drawer!
And don’t assume getting organized is a one time activity. It needs maintenance and upkeep as much as anything else in your life. You don’t buy a car and then assume because it works well the day you got it that it will continue to do so without any effort!
Whew! Apparently I have a lot of thoughts on this topic!!
@Leigh, good suggestions!
Well, we have a household of 3 (plus store some belongings of a fourth) and we would definitely be leaning more towards minimalism (and organization!) if it were just me. But we can all find our Important Stuff and that is what counts. Meanwhile I am pretty much done decluttering my personal belongings and I have permission to organize some "categories" not owned by myself. There is year on year improvement!
I would call myself a middle-malist. I like my home to be cozy with rugs and pillows and art on the wall, and lots of color. I also have some hobbies that involve stuff, like cooking and board games. However,I don’t have a lot of wall space or flat surfaces, and I am very anti-clutter/mess to the point that I feel uncomfortable staying in a couple of family member’s homes that do have a lot of stuff around (not hoarding level, just messy.) I live in a small space and too much stuff around makes it feel even smaller.
Last year I made a resolution called “The Time is Now” to start going through my place and using each object in turn, especially because I did a bit of accumulating during the pandemic. I have really enjoyed it, and plan to continue next year since I just started making a dent. In some cases I have realized that things don’t work well for me and I have rehomed them, some things I have used up (a large scented candle collection) and some things I have pulled out and used for the first time in years. It’s a bit of an at-home treasure hunt that has been pretty fun.
@Jenny, may I borrow the term "middle-malist"?
I am glad that you spent time making a distinction between the various labels (maximalist, minimalist, hoarder, etc.) in this discussion. And that you have clearly given a lot of thought and compassion to understanding what goes on when people accumulate various stuff.
I want to add that I think "hoarding" is a relative term. For example, suppose someone has assigned one room in a home to all their stuff (Open and it's packed like one of those storage units you see on tv.) If the bulk of possessions are in that room, and the rest of the house/apartment is not filled with too much in terms of the stuff to space ratio, is that still hoarding?
It's interesting to me that many of the folks who accuse others (folks with very limited space, especially an apartment, but also small homes) of being hoarders if, say, they hae a neatly ordered pantry or store bulk items throughout a space.
Meanwhile, those same folks may actually have far more stuff but...they have an attic, a basement, a spare room a garage, all filled with items but they are not in plain sight. So, who then is the hoarder? It really is about the amount of stuff in the available space.
If you've got four areas versus one to store the same amount of stuff...why will the person with the least space and the most stuff in it, the hoarder? I hope I'm making my point.
Some of us folks have a lot of stuff in proportion to available space. The reasons why are many and many are practical. You come to a point in life where you literally cannot afford to replace things. So some folks store items that they know they will need when other stuff falls apart and they can't replace (we acquire more duplicates of some items, think kitchen utensils and small appliances) them. It doesn't happen as much these days because appliances and such stop working and fall apart in a couple of years, if they last this long (Unlike a toaster oven I've had since the late 1980s! In the same time, we've gone through almost 8 microwaves as they just don't last anymore.)
Then there is the whole pantry stocking issue. We started a pantry during Covid, with a few starts before that for financial reasons. Years and years ago I read the tips that an economist gave about saving money and it was basically to stock up on the stuff you use/eat a lot when it's on sale. He recommended buying in bulk long before you had Costco and Sams and BJs. And over the years, we did it for a few items (tuna fish, toilet paper, beans, paper towels, cleaning products).
Over the years the categories we kept in a pantry increased as we started to see prices rise. Now, to me, it makes no sense to not keep a pantry (keeping in mind that you will actually eat/use before the expiration dates, otherwise, food waste. And yes, it is experimenting to do this.)
Many folks are also collectors (books is ours) and get great joy, no matter the space taken up, with that.
I get the whole "If it doesn't bring you joy, ditch it." but our feelings change over time. What brought joy once may now be a bad reminder. Out it goes, but some things? They remain precious and irreplaceable.
Also, the amount of time we use certain items may change over time (just as what we enjoy eating can vary greatly over even a few months. What we loved for months, we now no longer want to eat. It happens even with adults.) and to simply toss because you aren't currently using is a sometimes highly regrettable decision.
We had a major cleanout about a decade ago due to health issues (that required space for various equipment, etc.). We went it vigorously. As a result, we tossed things that we still regret tossing. Worse, we had to replace some of those very things...at $$$ to us. The worst.
Much of the clearouts we have is prompted by the old: If we aren't using it, we need to move it along to someone who can use it. (This happens a lot with clothes over the years.) We do often acquire more items than we even know we have. I counted the number of black cotton tops I have accumulated and was SHOCKED!)
This really makes it easy to get stuff out of the house and hopefully into the hands of those who can use. One of the things that has been happening where we live is that the places who take donations are now very strict about what they will take, and have eliminated a whole lot of things, including housewares, for lack of space. Meanwhile, every day NextDoor is filled with those writing who need items.
Our latest group of items to tackle: Various dinner/serving ware used for parties, that we no longer host. Lots of gorgeous (and expensive) pieces acquired over decades. But they are just sitting there when someone else could use. And that is just NOT a good thing.
One thing that makes it harder to get good quality items (not junk that you are tossing because it is in bad shape) is places that will pick up the stuff you are donating. (That's why you see tons of couches/sofas/recliners with "free if you pick up" on various listings such as NextDoor, FacebookMarketplace and Craigs List.
I truly resent when others judge how other people live. Especially when the labels are extremely judgmental and sometimes just plain mean and nasty.
The stuff you see on hoarder shows is NOT the average home/apartment that has a lot of stuff, particularly because so many people have organized stuff (I loathe the term clutter because again, it is a subjective term. To some people more than two of anything is clutter but most of us need more than two sets of forks, knives and spoons.)
Again, I love that you are not only not being judgmental but asking others to rethink how they approach this whole topic.
If you can function in your home, and it works for you, that's what it's about. Now, if stuff makes it impossible to safely move around and/or function, then that's a whole other situation, no matter how much stuff you have. (I've seen homes where people don't have stuff/clutter but have tons of furniture in a room and it feels really uncomfortable. And I've seen homes where there is stuff but you can move around and you feel comfortable. And not overwhelmed. Again it is relative. I worked for someone whose office was beyond minimalism: One chair, one desk. The file cabinets were in another room and her inbox had to be almost empty at any moment. Her wardrobe, too , was minimal, although that made more sense given her work.)
Live and let live. The problem of course is when one or more persons share space and one or more are uncomfortable with what is in that space. That is where a lot of the issues come in. Example: The bedroom. Some folks absolutely must have a nightstand on each side of the bed and they use to hold a lot of stuff. Others cannot abide anything in or around the bed. Makes for some interesting discussions.
As always, thanks for raising topics that encourage us to share and in doing so, opens us up to how others live and think.
@Irena, I think of the one friend I have who is a hoarder and the difference between her house and a home with lots of stuff is that her house is filthy because she cannot move things enough to clean, so there is mold and I think some shrews living inside. Also, she cannot walk through her house without both sides of her body rubbing against stacks of stuff more than head high. She fell once and could not turn enough to crawl to a phone and was saved only because she fell near the front door and screamed when she heard the postman delivering mail. The EMTs could not get a gurney to her because of the mess, they could not even stand on either side of her to sort of scoot her toward the doorway and the gurney. They had to spend time clearing a space, which could have meant she died if her emergency had been her heart or a stroke. Those of us who knew her before this illness got out of hand have tried to encourage her to see a therapist, even offering to drive her there. She has had offers to help clean up the place. Her husband has died and her children have tried desperately to get her help or to clean out the place, but so far she is of sound mind so they have no recourse. The best her friends do is stay friends by asking her out or having her come over to one of our homes for lunch---no one in their right mind would eat at her place.
I just happened to watch something on YouTube--a woman's huge huge huge walk-in closet, basically the size of a studio apartment in our city.
She had tons of clothing, shoes and accessories all neatly stored.
If that same amount of stuff had been housed in a one-bedroom apartment or home, it would take up a huge amount of space. So if she lived in that small space, with the same stuff, is she a hoarder?
Again, it's all relative to how much stuff, how much space and how organized.
We knew folks who used several armoires (Ikea) in every room in their home, bedroom, kitchen, living room to store a variety of items. They had tons of stuff, but you never saw it. The same amount of stuff left out on open shelving, etc. would have many folks calling them hoarders. It's really all about the stuff to space ratio with how it's organized thrown in.
The same way, items hidden away in a kitchen make it look less cluttered than if they are left out (We have tons out in our kitchen because we have physical access issues. I hate it but function is more important than design/appearance given our physical limitations.)
If I had my way, nothing would be visible. NOTHING. Now that just isn't possible for the majority of folks.
We can move around our space and we have only one area (the space in the living room assigned as our "home office" where things are a bit tight but we just don't now have room anywhere else for it.) that is not to our liking space wise.
Also, a note: The longer you live in any space, the more you will accumulate stuff even if you rigorously review and toss/donate all the time. (One in, one out just doesn't work for most of us but setting up specific times in the year to purge definitely does.)
@Irena, Thank you for pointing out that physical limitations can play a role in what is left out in the kitchen. I just do not have the strength to lift things like the Crock Pot or the Kitchen Aide mixer, but I use them both. Our cabinets all have pull out shelves that pull themselves back into the closed position at the slightest touch or push, but you still have to be able to lift things off the shelves onto the counter.
I am always baffled by scenes in movies, on TV, on stage, where a room is beautifully furnished, yet when someone opens a drawer for an important plot point to find an item, (a gun, a letter, a photo, etc.), IT IS THE ONLY THING IN THERE! Who lives like that?
Likewise in mystery books, the murder victim's apartment, or even whole house, is searched for clues, and the detectives are done in a couple hours. Seriously?
I'm enjoying this discussion as a tends-a-little-toward-minimalist. A colleague once remarked that an item that sits in place for two weeks becomes invisible. (like mail on my desk or on the edge of the bookshelf). Stuff not put away does become invisible, and I have to make a point to find it and move it along.
@Heidi Louise, We call that “moving at the speed of plot.” Of course it takes a lot longer than that IRL but do we, the viewers, really want to spend the time to watch that?
@WilliamB, Oh, no: I don't want to watch time passing. I also believe that DNA results are available before the next commercial break from one of several gazillian instantly searchable databases.
I am a minimalist. After we retired we moved into a Sprinter van that had been converted into a motorhome. We could carry very little so we sold, probably, 99% of what we owned. Now that we no longer live in a van we still don't own much. I am amazed at how little we actually need.
ps. Our junk drawer is two plastic shoe boxes hidden in a file cabinet. That file cabinet is also used as a side table to hold a lamp and our beverages between our chairs.
I must say that I have categories where I am a maximalist. I have more books than most people and more artwork too., including but not limited to sculptures. I dislike messy and chaotic living spaces, no rugs, no useless stuff, and everything has a place . I have about 15 dresses hanging by color. I have a box of traveling clothes. I have 3 sets of sheets for every bed. Where I am an ultra maximalist is in the food department. We have a running pantry with about a month of food for family and animals and a deep pantry for at the very least a year for family and animals. Many factors to this, I was raised by shoah survivors and food was a big thing. I live on a fairly isolated island that a bit at the end of the line( food delivery by boat) . I am also a prepper, not a scary survivalist with dream about end time but a realistic mother that see how fragile the world is and know it’s important to support your own when things go down.
Just over ten years ago, a hospital in Seattle told me to go home and get into hospice care. A visit to the ER and a surgeon who happened to be there and passing by changed my life, did and emergency and suddenly no more hospice. However, before the ER visit, I spent my days after I got home from Seattle, clearing out the house. A friend would come by for a few hours and help with things I could not manage, and also would leave and take things to distribute to the dump, the Rescue Mission, and so on. I did not want my husband to be stuck with the task, so I was ruthless. One morning he came in and said it felt like I was getting rid of all our history, that even things that I thought were stupid were reminders of me to him. He had been feeling that way from the first day but kept his mouth shut because he thought it was how I was dealing with dying, but seeing me erase memories of our life together had become too much for him to keep silent. Now I still declutter, since both of us tend to accumulate things (books me and tools him) but I give him the respect of making sure the items are not something he wants around if I croak.
@Lindsey, so glad you are still around. i often give my hubby instructions regarding the kids or something else in case i am not around. i am five years older than him.
I read this on a minimalism site and it made sense to me. We have a 2600 sq ft traditional house. We have been trying to downsize to a one story ranch. But so far no luck. Ranches are scarce in this part of the city.
Anyway someone wrote with the same problem and said they were going to downsize their house by 1/2 so when a ranch or independent living came available they would be ready to go. So I took this to heart and probably did half. What I found out is it is so much better to live with. And cleaning is so much better.
I fall in the middle.
There were 5-6 of us cleaning out my parents house, it took about 9 months. There was SO much stuff. I do not want anyone to spend months clearing out our house.
After my kids flew the coop we kept only their childhood toys, so glad I did as the grands play with them now. Other than puzzles I don't have a lot of things that are not used on a regular basis in the house.
I think when the time comes to downsize I will be ready. My neighbor just moved to a condo and she said you never really know how much you have till you move!
I had to think about this topic most of the day because both my mother and brother were hoarders. The situation with my brother's home was so bad it most likely caused his death from either mold or a rodent-borne virus. As often happens, I am the opposite. Not a minimalist but very much someone who does not keep things that are broken or not being used regularly, and I take excellent care of my belongings. Everything has its place. I don't take up aspirational hobbies. It's very much a right-size, utilitarian life.
There’s a song I heard, I think it’s about love but my mind applies a verse to just life. “ sometimes all I need is the air that I breathe”
I don’t like stuff much. If I could I’d just wander about with some essential things. But I like to stretch out on something comfy to sleep and I like showers and baths so I’m not a vagabond. I maintained a home for family for decades so I can do the nesting thing. I find minimalist “decor” serene and relaxing which is kinda weird cause I love being outside and nature is full of untidy chaos.
I’m definitely closer to the maximalist end of the spectrum ~and~ it’s 90% organized and tidy, and I almost always know where something is. Except paper, paper is more of a challenge. If it’s not organized and mostly tidy, I get unhappy about that.
Stuff accumulates over time and I acquire less of it now. For example, I have a big yarn stash mostly because the two knitting stores I worked for eventually went out of business, and gave me the employee discount on top of the going out of business discount. Now I rarely buy yarn except when I travel, as a sort of functional souvenir. OTOH, I do travel a lot… I read new books from the library, buying a copy only if I want to read it a second time. OTOH I reread a lot…
I got rid of a bunch of stuff when we moved although not as much as you might expect as the new house is larger. To my surprise I’m finding the bigger house to be less stressful, and the extra size makes it easier for my roommate to be tidy, or at least keep the untidy in his room. (Cf above re untidiness and unhappiness.)
If my house burned down I doubt I’d end up with as much stuff as I have now. Even so, I don’t want to get rid of what I have. Because of the move, every piece has been pondered and judged worth keeping. It’s not that I want a lot of small tables, it’s that I want the small hand-carved folding table I bought in Botswana.
@WilliamB, I'm practically drooling hearing about the 2 yarn stores going out of business + the employee discount. But it stresses me out to think of all the yarn I already own, the number of sweaters/scarves/socks/hats that outnumber the days I have with the appropriate weather to wear them. I've been on a yarn diet for years, currently making a baby blanket with remnants, finished a scarf with remnants, and just not seeming to make a dent. However, the yarn fits into just one trunk and one basket.
I guess I would be a few ticks toward maximalism, but not because I want to live there! I’ve been very careful about not acquiring more stuff, but not so great at getting rid of things. I’ve been married 45 years and my wedding gown is still in the closet. My daughter didn’t want it, and my one granddaughter is t going to want it either! I do participate in the 40 days of Lent cleanse, which is to get rid of a bag of stuff each day. Somehow, things creep back in. When I take down the Christmas decor, there is going to be a major purge, as I need to reclaim my part of the basement. Cleaning out my aunt and uncles house was not helpful, and we are going to be cleaning out my mom’s house soon. I’m not emotionally connected to many things, I just feel guilty to the landfill piles. Thank goodness for charities that accept my unwanted things!
One thought about your P.P.S.
We consider hoarding a problem, & I do think it is a problem & I agree that we need to show compassion. I've had family members & friends who've lived this way & it's a real struggle. But, we don't seem to consider the other extreme a problem? Typically if we're extreme in anything, it's because there is something wrong or off balance somewhere? Some experience or physical reason that we act in an extreme way.
I'm thinking out loud with this comment. I just wonder if the same mental stresses that cause hoarding can also cause extreme minimalism? It just comes out in a different way with different people? We just don't see it as stress because having less stuff is less stressful. To me extreme minimalism shows a person wants to have tight control on their lives & one way we can do that is through the things we own or don't own.
Anyway, those were my thoughts as I read your post. I am somewhere in the middle, closer to hoarding in some areas but not extreme. I don't struggle with finding things & my house is pretty organized...I don't have a junk drawer. (but I do have a junk room! my storeroom) It's an organized room with all the stuff that doesn't fit typically in any other room.
@Jenny Young the hoarding I’ve seen on tv is a health and safety hazard I don’t see how minimalism is either of those.
That's true, but I do see the point about the possible overlap; OCD could certainly be at play with an extreme obsession with NOT owning things.
@Tiana, I think it’s interesting that in most all major religions minimal possessions is regarded a virtue and their principal examples practiced it…Jesus, Muhammad, Buddha, Gandhi. In Judaism Abraham, Moses, David and others were rich.
Was Gandhi OCD? lol there were plenty who thought everyone I mentioned above crazy.
what would life be like without a junk drawer? i really don't want to know. i would be a decent minimalist if it weren't for my family whom i adore. hubby and two teens. they are PACKRATS. but when it comes to clothes one in one out. have done that all my adult life. and when the kids were small a toy came in 5 went out. i dunno my daughter collects dolls and my son trains even though they are now teens. i try to go with the flo in our one bedroom, one bathroom 750 sq ft apt with an ice rink in one of the playgrounds from november through march.
I would say I’m in the middle but leaning a little more toward minimalist since I am hoping to downsize houses in the new year. I’ve been purging for a year now in anticipation of moving. I’ve become quite the master of finding homes for items we no longer want/need, so much so that my friends hand off items to me to find new homes for. I only want to move the items we really want to take and not have to deal with purging during the packing process or once we move. During this process I have also given a lot of thought to not wanting our children to have to deal with excess things once we’re gone. I try to be organized but there will always be a junk drawer along with some items where we have more than we need and I’m ok with that. My house is neat/clean and we are both happy and that is what matters to us.
OMG @Kristen - sooo many shoes lol. But I have a hard to fit foot which usually limits the pairs of shoes I have. Eh, my sister, I started calling her Imelda decades ago. And sad to say, a sign of Alzheimer's in my mother (and not just shoes and not just items for her).
A lot of my "clutter" is items that needed to be OUT of my parents' home due to mom's Alzheimer's. Despite garage "sailing", still have not only made in USA toys/clothing from my kids but from my youth too. Pretty much the "clutter" is not from buying too much.
Which reminds me I do need to replenish paper goods lol. One can never had too much toilet paper (sorry Duchess of Windsor).
I admit it I own a LOT of stuff. Much of it related to Arts & crafts or sewing. it occurred to me some months ago that I will never complete all the projects I have planned for "someday".
My parents were children of the depression, when I was growing up and I often heard "you never know when you might need that".
One day a neighbor asked me if I had a shoehorn he could borrow. As I gave it to him I realized it had been years since I used a shoehorn but I was holding onto it just in case. From that point on I determined that I would reframe my thinking to when I hear someone needs something I have they become the reason I held on to such and such. My Buy Nothing group has been a great way to meet other peoples needs and continue to save things for someday.
PS it's difficult for me to describe my philosophy adequately, but I hope you can get the jist of where I stand on the continuum.
Personally, I have a tendency for my stuff to expand to fit the available space to a certain extent.
I’ve lived very comfortably in tiny dorms, small apartments, modest townhomes, and larger single-family homes (and not in that order - one move carried us from modest single-family with garage to small apartment).
The key, for me, has been to learn the distinct steps of maintaining a loving space, and to do all of them regularly:
1. Declutter
2. Organized
3. Tidy
4. Clean
When I’m decluttering a space, I’m not worried about the other 3 - I’m focused on removing things from that space. When I’m organizing, I might also get rid of a few items or wipe down a dusty shelf or vacuum out a drawer, but I don’t get hung up on a lot of cleaning. I’m focused on organizing that space to make it work better for me.
I think the other part for me is that I’m regularly assessing my spaces as I use them, noting “pain points” and trying to improve usability. For example, in our bathroom we don’t have good storage (previous owners did a remodel that invited removing the medicine cabinet and installing a nice-to-look-at vanity with very poor storage). After living with that for a while, I took the decorative picture shelves they’d installed and just flipped them over so the ledge faced down and the shelf could hold our products/items. I still have to dust more often than if we just had a medicine cabinet, but it got almost everything off that vanity basically fit free, so now I’m not knocking things over when I dry my hair!
(I also intentionally bought a hairdryer with a retractable cord the last time I had to replace it, so I can just toss the whole thing in the one big drawer that we have, no temptation to leave it out on turn counter to get wet when someone uses the sink).
If there is a hoarding gene, I probably have it. My mother exhibited symptoms. So I try to be very cognizant of what I hang onto: is it useful to me now? will I likely need it in the near future? is it even necessary in my life? I am organized and work to store the items I do keep well. But, I am very frugal and can't stand waste. It is a constant battle! LOL
The idea that some of us can handle/manage more items than others is what Dana K. White has coined as “clutter threshold”. Some of us can’t keep a lot of items neat and tidy like others and have a lower threshold, so we need to have less for our home’s to stay under control. She has a podcast “A Slob Comes Clean” that is great help on keeping your house under control.
I strive to be a minimalist but it’s really hard for me to throw things away and it is a work in progress.